"Infraction" - pathetic and insulting policy

[istara]

I spent time and effort today creating a comprehensive list of iPhone RPGs. It was put on a completely non-commercial, ad-free site (on tumblr, just because it was free, quick and convenient for me). I did this solely for the benefit of other RPG fans. I put a link to it on here - and wham! the thread was deleted and I got something called an "infraction point".

This is a truly pathetic policy. If I had put up a link to a commercial, non-game-related, spammy, malware ridden site then fair enough. But I didn't. The page that I created and linked to was intended to be a useful resource. It even linked back to relevant game threads on TouchArcade and other third-party sites where there was useful information about the game.

And then I was told in a private message that I could instead "paste" my work into a thread on your site!!! I mean are you joking? Do you seriously think that someone would do hard work in good faith and community spirit, be insulted and accused of "self-promotion" in response, and then give you my work for free on your own, commercial site?

You guys seriously need to take a good hard look at yourselves and your policies! Because this is absolutely pathetic.

[FilthyCanadian]

It's pretty clear that you were self promoting your site. What does it matter where they see your work as long as people see it?

[NotYou]

Infractions are just warnings. It's in the rules that you're not allowed to link to your own site. You can put it in you sig, however. I didn't give you the infraction, but they're mainly used as warnings to let you know the rules.

[CDubby94]

I have a question about infractions, are they worth points? I noticed next to mine it says Expiration/Point Value or something like that.

Is there a certain number of points you aquire before being banned kind of like in a work place? And then do those points expire over time so that the infraction is erased after the expiration date and you lose those points?

The Expiration/Point Value just confused me a little, so I'm curious as to how the infrations work.

[worldcup1100]

I have a question about infractions, are they worth points? I noticed next to mine it says Expiration/Point Value or something like that.

Is there a certain number of points you aquire before being banned kind of like in a work place? And then do those points expire over time so that the infraction is erased after the expiration date and you lose those points?

The Expiration/Point Value just confused me a little, so I'm curious as to how the infrations work.

I was about to ask that too, an answer would be much appreciated.:D

[arn]

I was about to ask that too, an answer would be much appreciated.:D

It can be used in that way, but we mainly use it as a tracking system.

If someone gets multiple infractions for the same issue, then next time they may get banned for a period of time.

As for the original poster: We certainly don't expect you to paste your work into this forum. But that's your option if your true intent is to simply "spread the knowledge" as many people claim they are trying to do.

If that's not acceptable, then you are, in fact, looking to drive traffic to your site. Whether it's commercial or not, we don't allow it because it encourages more of the same.

arn

[LBG]

I recieved an infraction because apparently, the image I posted was too big. Although it is no big deal, it would be nice if it said something about it in the forum rules (see below), it says nothing about the size of images. I presumed that if an image was too large, then it would be resized to fit the thread. However as I now know, this is not the case.

- Don't post advertisements for your blog/podcast/youtube-channel on the site. (signature links are acceptable within reason). Self promotion is strictly prohibited.
- Developers are welcome to post app announcements, but please identify yourself as the developer
- Only developers may post promo code giveaways.
- Don't beg/ask for promo codes or beta testing
- Don't insult people - if you can't keep yourself from insulting others, you don't belong here
- Don't post multiple threads on the same topic
- Don't post in the WRONG forum ("iPhone games" is for games only)
- Please use a descriptive title ("Help" is not descriptive)
- Keep threads on topic - obviously things can stray onto related topics, but we've seen threads stray into personal and irrelevant topics.
- Don't bump threads. This applies not only to posts that say "bump" but to those with the intent to bump.
- Please avoid correcting spelling and grammar. English is not the primarily language for many people, and grammar discussion does not really add anything of substance to most discussions
- Please post in English. Despite our international audience, this is an English language site.
- One account per user. Don't post to multiple accounts.
- Don't post fake announcements or impersonate individuals or companies
- Shill accounts will result in a site-wide ban of the site, product or developer
- No piracy. Discussion about piracy in the abstract is acceptable. But links or how-to's or where to get pirated software will quickly result in banning
- Please keep language "clean"

[Zincous]

I recieved an infraction because apparently, the image I posted was too big. Although it is no big deal, it would be nice if it said something about it in the forum rules (see below), it says nothing about the size of images. I presumed that if an image was too large, then it would be resized to fit the thread. However as I now know, this is not the case.

That was not me who gave you the infraction. But I found it quite funny :D

Lol that image was huge :eek:....although not specifically in the rules as "Don't post large images"

It could fall into the category of "- Use common sense" which is in the rules. It's kind of annoying when picture are so big they make you scroll left/right to see them :p. And people on iphones/ipod touches viewing the site would take 2X the time to load the page to see it. As well as take up a lot of unnecessary storage on the site. If everyone did that.....:rolleyes:

I'm glad to see you don't think it's a big deal :)

[brewstermax]

Oh, I get infractions occasionally. One from arn back in the day, and one more recently from Hodapp because I fired back at 💩💩💩💩💩💩💩💩💩 after she'd be b*tching at me. Appearently, that's "Really Inappropriate Harassment". Whatever. I don't really care all that much. I don't usually repeat the same things twice, and I think that as long as I stay away from Spam City up there, I can stay out of trouble from flaming the spamming n00bs. I did hear once that you have to get 10 infractions in a week to be permanently banned? I would like to hear from arn if there is any legitimacy to that one.

[Zincous]

I did hear once that you have to get 10 infractions in a week to be permanently banned? I would like to hear from arn if there is any legitimacy to that one.

I'm not arn, but I can tell you there's no 10 infraction limit per week thing before a permanent ban.

True, at that rate, you will be high on the radar for being banned if you've found a way to get to ten without being banned already. :rolleyes:

It depends on what the infractions are for, really. If they are for all the same thing, they clearly aren't listening.

You can easily be banned for having less than 10 infractions depending on what it's for.

[jchampl]

I recieved an infraction because apparently, the image I posted was too big. Although it is no big deal, it would be nice if it said something about it in the forum rules (see below), it says nothing about the size of images. I presumed that if an image was too large, then it would be resized to fit the thread. However as I now know, this is not the case.


that image was rediculous. just saying.
:p

[jchampl]

You can easily be banned for having less than 10 infractions depending on what it's for.

What if VoodooVyp and I engage in a little PDA on the forums?
If I transcribe all the lyrics to "baby got back" and post them?
How about if I post nuddie pics of BigAl?


Will any of these result in trouble? I will make sure to post the last two in the lounge ;)
:D :p

[istara]

It's pretty clear that you were self promoting your site. What does it matter where they see your work as long as people see it?
Really? Did you see my original thread, and did you actually visit the link?

I'm not going to post it again here or even pm it to people, but if you want to email me - istara@gmail.com - I will send you the link and you can make your own judgement.

For the record, it's a page on a tumblr blog that has only about three entries in all, has no page counter, no ads, and no commenters. It barely qualifies as a "site". I stuck the list of games there because it was a free and easy bit of web space to use. I wanted other people to find the list useful, and to give feedback so I could add other/future RPGs to the list.

I've googled "iphone RPGs" and there is no comprehensive, updated list out there. That's why I made one. It's not a vanity project, it was intended to be a resource.

[The Bat Outta Hell]

Oh, I get infractions occasionally. One from arn back in the day, and one more recently from Hodapp because I fired back at 💩💩💩💩💩💩💩💩💩 after she'd be b*tching at me. Appearently, that's "Really Inappropriate Harassment". Whatever. I don't really care all that much. I don't usually repeat the same things twice, and I think that as long as I stay away from Spam City up there, I can stay out of trouble from flaming the spamming n00bs. I did hear once that you have to get 10 infractions in a week to be permanently banned? I would like to hear from arn if there is any legitimacy to that one.


Well, Candy technically left TA, but routinely checks in to see if me or rocketman919 is banned or in time out =/

We had our signatures taken for a while for quoting candy, I believe filthycanadian hasn't gotten his back yet =P

[jchampl]

Really? Did you see my original thread, and did you actually visit the link?

I'm not going to post it again here or even pm it to people, but if you want to email me - istara@gmail.com - I will send you the link and you can make your own judgement.

For the record, it's a page on a tumblr blog that has only about three entries in all, has no page counter, no ads, and no commenters. It barely qualifies as a "site". I stuck the list of games there because it was a free and easy bit of web space to use. I wanted other people to find the list useful, and to give feedback so I could add other/future RPGs to the list.

I've googled "iphone RPGs" and there is no comprehensive, updated list out there. That's why I made one. It's not a vanity project, it was intended to be a resource.


let me break it down for you real nice:

on the forums, don't post a link to your own website/blog, unless it is in your signature, it doesn't matter the content, counters, or anything, just don't do it, and you will be fine.

thems the rules......, everyone else follows them and you should too. If others don't they face the same thing you have, you are not being made an example of.


I just don't get why people get so upset about this crap, you don't pay to use this site, if someone that owns or runs the site says you can do this, why the hell do you feel you need to b & wine about it? it would be a lot easier for the person to say ok, I learned and now I'm going to be a big boy, and follow the rules as stupid as you may think they are.

[Thorero]

@istara, I didn't see the post, but I can pretty much imagine what it was like, no ads or anything.

Not might I ask a question? If for example I stumbled across istaras tumblr page, and then decided, for the good of the community, to post a link to it, that would be allowed, Correct? As it isn't self promotion.

[brewstermax]

Well, Candy technically left TA, but routinely checks in to see if me or rocketman919 is banned or in time out =/

We had our signatures taken for a while for quoting candy, I believe filthycanadian hasn't gotten his back yet =P

I'm sure she makes the same of me. It's stupid really. She made a thread about her sister dying. It's a games forum. Sure, it was in the lounge, but it is still grossly inappropriate here, and nobody wanted to see it. When someone posts ANYTHING, they must be open to criticism, which she obviously wasn't.

[FilthyCanadian]

Well, Candy technically left TA, but routinely checks in to see if me or rocketman919 is banned or in time out =/

We had our signatures taken for a while for quoting candy, I believe filthycanadian hasn't gotten his back yet =P

That's not what she checks back for.

Not yet.

[jchampl]

@istara, I didn't see the post, but I can pretty much imagine what it was like, no ads or anything.

Not might I ask a question? If for example I stumbled across istaras tumblr page, and then decided, for the good of the community, to post a link to it, that would be allowed, Correct? As it isn't self promotion.

yup, as long as you are not promoting your own page.

[istara]

let me break it down for you real nice:

on the forums, don't post a link to your own website/blog, unless it is in your signature, it doesn't matter the content, counters, or anything, just don't do it, and you will be fine.

thems the rules......, everyone else follows them and you should too. If others don't they face the same thing you have, you are not being made an example of.


I just don't get why people get so upset about this crap, you don't pay to use this site, if someone that owns or runs the site says you can do this, why the hell do you feel you need to b & wine about it? it would be a lot easier for the person to say ok, I learned and now I'm going to be a big boy, and follow the rules as stupid as you may think they are.
See I find it far more spammy to put a possibly commercial, possibly irrelevant site at the bottom of every post, than to one-off announce a site of specific interest created for the community.

Just because something is policy doesn't mean it isn't a stupid, wrong and crappy policy, and that the people implementing it in such a draconian fashion aren't stupid to do so.

Moderators should operate with discretion and intelligence, not just blindly follow policy that acts - at least in this instance - against the interest of site members.

But I guess you're either a dumb sheep or not, and dumb sheep are usually happy being that way.

[markx2]

See the bigger picture.
You have a rule that says You can or You cannot. It's very simple to read, it's very simple to police.

As soon as you start judging the rules fail. Where does a personal site become an affiliate site? How many ads on that site are okay? Will the site content be changed but links remain? How many posts do we then have saying "Hey, I made a great list!"? Arn and others do not need the hassle and neither do we as forum users. So it's a solid rule and if you do not like this find another site to go play in. I enforce similar rules on another site and they have to exist, they have to be policed and they have to be consistent. Sure Arn would like traffic to stay here (and why not, his hard work should not be leeched) but he is doing this as much for the readers. This is a quality site and it should remain so.

What you are failing to realise is that by posting such information and being helpful and constructive then you would both be seen as valuable and you would then get traffic to the sites in your sig.

But if all you want to do is complain, go find somewhere else.

[jchampl]

But I guess you're either a dumb sheep or not, and dumb sheep are usually happy being that way.


here's the thing, i'm a guest on this site, you are too. when you make a site that people actually want to go to, then you can make your own stupid rules. until then you are guest here and do what the rules clearly state. it's more work for the mods to go through every post and verify each site is a good site, so it's much easier to just say no sites. the fact that you do not get this worries me.

[le'deuche123]

Ohhh how do I check my infraction count?? I hope I have some good ones!!

[Booch138]

I see both sides to this but unfortunately I am going to agree with the OP. Though I do admit that rules are rules, rules preventing another user from actually posting helpful user information (especially when the site itself has no such thing) is pretty lame. Though it would be a hinder on the mods to monitor these types of things, and I am sure that's why they disallow it, a little time spent on forum goer's work shouldn't nessisarily go unnoticed. However, one thing I will disagree with on the OP, is b*tching about the situation. Though you have every intent on making this a helpful resource to us gamers, this is a free site, and you are a guest, and have to follow the rules as such. They do allow you to post it in your sig, so why not do that? That's a really simple way around it, or you could even post the information on the thread. Though it's not what you wanted, it would still get the information, which you want us to see, into the thread. Problem solved. Like I said, I see both views, but unfortunately rules are rules. Expect an email from me though, I would like to check it out. Thanks buddy,

Booch138

[Thorero]

Booch138, I have to say, this is the most logical post I've seen on this subject. Thank you for bringing a balance of normality.

[JTHM87]

I'm sure she makes the same of me. It's stupid really. She made a thread about her sister dying. It's a games forum. Sure, it was in the lounge, but it is still grossly inappropriate here, and nobody wanted to see it. When someone posts ANYTHING, they must be open to criticism, which she obviously wasn't.

I was wondering what went down while reading this thread..... Thanks for the clarification. That's gotta be a rule somewhere in the "How to Internets" handbook. Never ever post about someone dying and expect people from the net to give a crap and not make fun it you for it. Ever see the WoW Funeral that got crashed? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IHJVolaC8pw) Classic stuff right there. If you need people to help you during the grief process, seek friends/family not e-people.

[jchampl]

I was wondering what went down while reading this thread..... Thanks for the clarification. That's gotta be a rule somewhere in the "How to Internets" handbook. Never ever post about someone dying and expect people from the net to give a crap and not make fun it you for it. Ever see the WoW Funeral that got crashed? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IHJVolaC8pw) Classic stuff right there. If you need people to help you during the grief process, seek friends/family not e-people.
the funeral still isn't as good as this:
LkCNJRfSZBU

or the awesome remix:
-N6sqdrJzVo

atleast I have chicken!

[Booch138]

Booch138, I have to say, this is the most logical post I've seen on this subject. Thank you for bringing a balance of normality.

Bleh, what can I say. I am a democrat >.> I don't like both sides to go unnoticed, but still get my views across ;)

[Booch138]

I was wondering what went down while reading this thread..... Thanks for the clarification. That's gotta be a rule somewhere in the "How to Internets" handbook. Never ever post about someone dying and expect people from the net to give a crap and not make fun it you for it. Ever see the WoW Funeral that got crashed? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IHJVolaC8pw) Classic stuff right there. If you need people to help you during the grief process, seek friends/family not e-people.

I don't know. Normally I find that kind of stuff funny, but that funeral thing was kind of f*cked up no matter how you look at it. Yeah it's said that you don't go looking for support like that over the internet, but what people need to remember is that it completely alienates those who did know her and really tried to get something like that going. Not everyone would have been able to attend her RL funeral... Though it may not be the most contructive way to do it, at least she had friends/E-Friends and people who cared to try, and WoW just happened to be the way they wanted to do it. And as far as E-Friends go, there is nothing wrong with them, everyone has them. It's just sad when ALL of your friends are E-Friends. I mean yeah, that guild should have expected it coming, but come on... respect the dead... if even for just 5 f*cking minutes.

I don't know the whole story about the chick on here who posted about her deceased sister or whatever, but that doesn't make her wrong. She lost someone... have some f*cking sympathy, of course she's going to talk mad sh!t to those that give her flak. Though I don't agree with her using TA as the grieving point, and I don't think it was wrong for TA to take the action they did (After all... no one really wants to read that) but the WoW one I can sympathize, only because I lost an E-Friend who passed away. Never met him, never knew him, and never talked to him outside of Guild Chat and Ventrillo, but that doesn't mean I won't pay some respect.

[Albtraum]

@istara, I didn't see the post, but I can pretty much imagine what it was like, no ads or anything.

Not might I ask a question? If for example I stumbled across istaras tumblr page, and then decided, for the good of the community, to post a link to it, that would be allowed, Correct? As it isn't self promotion.

From reading this, my first instinct is to conclude that you are either the same person as istara, or his roommate, or sister, or something.

Am I wrong?

[istara]

I see both sides to this but unfortunately I am going to agree with the OP. Though I do admit that rules are rules, rules preventing another user from actually posting helpful user information (especially when the site itself has no such thing) is pretty lame. Though it would be a hinder on the mods to monitor these types of things, and I am sure that's why they disallow it, a little time spent on forum goer's work shouldn't nessisarily go unnoticed. However, one thing I will disagree with on the OP, is b*tching about the situation. Though you have every intent on making this a helpful resource to us gamers, this is a free site, and you are a guest, and have to follow the rules as such. They do allow you to post it in your sig, so why not do that? That's a really simple way around it, or you could even post the information on the thread. Though it's not what you wanted, it would still get the information, which you want us to see, into the thread. Problem solved. Like I said, I see both views, but unfortunately rules are rules. Expect an email from me though, I would like to check it out. Thanks buddy,

Booch138
Yeah it was kind of pointless me ranting about it, but I just felt like blowing off steam. I think that the rules of any community should serve that community, not be so absolute that they act against its interests.

I've modded communities before, and I've experienced the reams of spam and trolling and shit that goes on. I know it's not easy. You want people to have freedoms, but you end up making rules. But sometimes something comes up that needs a rule bend, or a rule reassessment. It might be someone wanting to advertise a charity drive that is really relevant to that community, even though ads aren't usually allowed in that community. It might be someone wanting to post an off-topic subject that is really critical and of interest to a lot of members of that community, like the funeral of a former, highly active member.

The point is you don't know until it happens, because it's a new situation. So instead of trying to use your existing rules to see how you can block it, you see how you can instead accommodate it.

Infraction points though: that's just another story. That is really pre-school, hall-monitor style modding. Infantile stuff.

[pharmx]

Yeah it was kind of pointless me ranting about it, but I just felt like blowing off steam. I think that the rules of any community should serve that community, not be so absolute that they act against its interests.

I've modded communities before, and I've experienced the reams of spam and trolling and shit that goes on. I know it's not easy. You want people to have freedoms, but you end up making rules. But sometimes something comes up that needs a rule bend, or a rule reassessment. It might be someone wanting to advertise a charity drive that is really relevant to that community, even though ads aren't usually allowed in that community. It might be someone wanting to post an off-topic subject that is really critical and of interest to a lot of members of that community, like the funeral of a former, highly active member.

The point is you don't know until it happens, because it's a new situation. So instead of trying to use your existing rules to see how you can block it, you see how you can instead accommodate it.

Infraction points though: that's just another story. That is really pre-school, hall-monitor style modding. Infantile stuff.

What you're talking about makes sense for smaller communities, like a Guild forum or a Facebook group. That being said, sometimes exceptions can and should be made for certain situations. I don't think being able to put up a link that drives traffic to a site is one of them though, no matter how useful the information might be. There's already spam attacks with people putting up malicious and/or inappropriate links here. Can you imagine how difficult it would be for the mods to have to monitor each and every link? Not to mention all the judgement calls that would have to be made on what's appropriate and what's not, and then all the complaints from the people who feel that their inappropriate links should be considered appropriate, etc?

[Thorero]

From reading this, my first instinct is to conclude that you are either the same person as istara, or his roommate, or sister, or something.

Am I wrong?


Yep, Wrong. I joined back in 11-14-2008. istara joined in 03-10-2009. Now seeing as I have no interest whatsoever in RPGs, hence, I wouldn't be the sort to create a list of 'em.

I'm not too sure where istara's located, but I'm pretty sure he isn't in the southern tip of Spain.

or sister
And what would make you think I'm female?

[HJJ]

I wouldn't be so upset about "infraction points". Isn't it just a standardized warning system? You didn't know the rules, and now you do. It's OK. Maybe you should have PMed a mod or written a less inflammatory post in this section. I happen to think your intention was benign, but this particular policy is legit and necessary.

In the end, it's not really a big deal. I'm sorry you feel insulted. I've been "warned" at another forum for "responding to a troll". Honestly, it pissed me off. But they have rules about stuff like that. You choose to participate in certain forums, and you agree to abide by their rules. What can you do?

[Yagami_Light]

I don't know. This is the most lenient message board that I have ever been on. I used to go on GameFAQs a lot, and they are freakin' fascists over there. They will moderate you for ANYTHING that you say, sometimes for no reason. If they don't agree with your opinion, you get moderated.

This site pwns most other sites.

[le'deuche123]

Where do you see infraction points???

[Zincous]

Where do you see infraction points???

I don't think you can see them if you don't have any. You get them in a private message. I'm not sure what a standard account looks like exactly with an infraction.

But you do not have any le'deuche123.

[dannys95]

Where do you see infraction points???

Go to your profile and if you have any you will see a "infractions' button. I think only mods/admins and the user itself can see those though.

I have 4, one was bogus, and one I can explain.

[le'deuche123]

Wow I'm slightly shocked that I have none....not that I'm complaining, but I thought I caused way more trouble than that....perhaps I'm not as evil as I thought:(

[GatorDeb]

I don't know the whole story about the chick on here who posted about her deceased sister or whatever, but that doesn't make her wrong. She lost someone... have some f*cking sympathy, of course she's going to talk mad sh!t to those that give her flak. Though I don't agree with her using TA as the grieving point, and I don't think it was wrong for TA to take the action they did (After all... no one really wants to read that) but the WoW one I can sympathize, only because I lost an E-Friend who passed away. Never met him, never knew him, and never talked to him outside of Guild Chat and Ventrillo, but that doesn't mean I won't pay some respect.

Woman, not chick ;)

The thread was just a very short poem saying how much she missed her sister. That's it. Didn't bother me. And it was in the Lounge. But people started posting that it should be locked and how inappropriate it was, and it was locked. I don't think it was locked because it was inappropriate, but because of the replies someone was bound to get their feelings hurt.

[JTHM87]

Woman, not chick ;)

The thread was just a very short poem saying how much she missed her sister. That's it. Didn't bother me. And it was in the Lounge. But people started posting that it should be locked and how inappropriate it was, and it was locked. I don't think it was locked because it was inappropriate, but because of the replies someone was bound to get their feelings hurt.

The problem with things like that is that one must remember the internet is filled with people who don't care about other people's feelings. Making posts in a public forum (be it a lounge or not) about something so personal is very risky unless the forum is dedicated to the subject matter. A better way of going about what she did would have been to Twitter, LiveJournal, or even place it in her Sig. Starting a whole thread just attracts the forum stalkers and they can't help but +1 their post count by chiming in.


That being said I also think it's a weird thread. :(

About the WoW Funeral thing....they picked a PVP zone. They seriously were asking for it by having the E-funeral there. The Temple of Elune in Darnassus is pretty enough so why not have it there where flocks of horde are less likely to barge in? Pretty silly if you ask me.

To be a little more back on topic, though I suppose the whole Candythread incident pertains to infractions in a way.... Why not copy/paste at least *SOME* of the content from the page you set up and then direct people to the link in your signature if they want to see more of it? Maybe that isn't allowed either I don't know. It's a great thing that communities like this prohibit things like that because it would get out of hand so fast. Who do you approve/deny? What's the grey area? Better to just disallow it entirely.

[CDubby94]

I don't think infraction points are preschool... I think they're organized and logical, the same system is used in most workplaces. If you do something wrong, you get a certain number of points depending upon how severe the infraction was. If you mess up enough and get enough points you'll be fired.

[GatorDeb]

Can someone explain to me the WOW funeral thingie? I saw part of the video but I still don't get it (have never played it).

[Eli]

We don't even use the points system here. I think Vbulletin can be configured to have points automatically expire after a certain amount of time and if you exceed a certain amount of points you get banned. Not sure, the system doesn't make sense.

Infractions on Touch Arcade are just a quick and easy way to say "Hey! Don't do this!" When we hit this button http://forums.toucharcade.com/images/buttons/infraction.gif all it does is copy your post in to a PM without need to do the extra work of finding the link to your post, copying it, pasting it, and then doing the same with the post content.

It's just a shortcut.

The best way to never deal with the infraction system, or have to worry about the consequences is to simply follow the rules!

[The Bat Outta Hell]

We don't even use the points system here. I think Vbulletin can be configured to have points automatically expire after a certain amount of time and if you exceed a certain amount of points you get banned. Not sure, the system doesn't make sense.

Infractions on Touch Arcade are just a quick and easy way to say "Hey! Don't do this!" When we hit this button http://forums.toucharcade.com/images/buttons/infraction.gif all it does is copy your post in to a PM without need to do the extra work of finding the link to your post, copying it, pasting it, and then doing the same with the post content.

It's just a shortcut.

The best way to never deal with the infraction system, or have to worry about the consequences is to simply follow the rules!

So are you saying infractions count even if they're expired? We could get banned for many expired infractions, then doing one more?

[The Bat Outta Hell]

Woman, not chick ;)

The thread was just a very short poem saying how much she missed her sister. That's it. Didn't bother me. And it was in the Lounge. But people started posting that it should be locked and how inappropriate it was, and it was locked. I don't think it was locked because it was inappropriate, but because of the replies someone was bound to get their feelings hurt.

http://forums.toucharcade.com/showthread.php?t=8910

I think it was locked also because of her reaction to people criticizing her. It ended up in a big flame war, which led to her reporting all of them against her poem =/

[Eli]

So are you saying infractions count even if they're expired? We could get banned for many expired infractions, then doing one more?

There isn't any rule set in stone where X infractions result in a ban. It's on a case by case basis. If you have a consistent history of getting infractions for harassing people for instance, you should probably consider not doing that anymore if you value your Touch Arcade membership.

Like I said though, best way to not have to worry about it is by just following the rules.

[Booch138]

I don't know. This is the most lenient message board that I have ever been on. I used to go on GameFAQs a lot, and they are freakin' fascists over there. They will moderate you for ANYTHING that you say, sometimes for no reason. If they don't agree with your opinion, you get moderated.

This site pwns most other sites.

Yeah I quit posting in gamefaqs.com. F*ck them. Their boards blow anyways.

Yeah this site and gametrailers.com are both pretty lenient (with the exception of GT.com, which hardly has any rules =P) So I post both here and there.

GatorDeb: Can someone explain to me the WOW funeral thingie? I saw part of the video but I still don't get it (have never played it).

Long story short: There are 2 factions, Alliance and Horde. There are 3 types of servers, PvP (Neutral Area's are free reign to kill people in) PvE (Neutral Area's can be accessed without worrying about people killing you, unless you red flag yourself) and Role Playing, which is just... well everyone is happy there. rofl.

A Woman had a guild on the Horde faction, and was pretty high up in it, or at least a regular active member of the guild. She passed away, so her guildies decided to have a little memorial for her in a Neutral Zone that she fished and hung out a lot at. They are on a PvP server. The guildies posted on the WoW.com forums about the time and date of when the services will be held. People, including thier opposing faction the Alliance, caught wind of the services and decided to crash it, and by that I mean going and killing everyone lined up at the 'services'. Not only crash it, but they recorded it. Yes, it was bound to happen, and yes it was stupid that it was in a Neutral Zone, but I seriously felt morally struck by that. I don't know what it was, but I guess it was a combo of the disaster that took place, and the fact that everyone was laughing about it.

Like I said, I know that it was bound to happen, and I know that they could have picked a place of their own faction, so no one could f*ck with them. But still, call me a hippy or whatever, but it's the fact that there was enough people gathered to have the indecency to F*ck with a funeral? I'm thinkin about getting all the info I can on them, killing them in RL, and crashing their funeral. I bet that would be EPICWINROFLLULZ. F*cking assholes. Humans really do make me sick. Especially ones on the internet.

Now I may not be the nicest person, and my humor is VERY VERY crude (You know, dead baby jokes, racism, things that "cross the line", etc. it all makes me laugh) But when it comes to ****ing with someone who is actually dead IRL, at least give the deceased, and the ones who knew them at least 5 minutes of respect. And that means a funeral, if even on a f*cking video game, and even if it's silly. At least give them that. That's one more thing that would just make the people who are ALREADY GRIEVING worse.

Hope that helps GatorDeb, and sorry for the one-sided opinion. Few things irk me that bad, but that thing was one of them.

[GatorDeb]

Thanks for the explanation :D

But if there existed a server where you couldn't kill on a neutral area, why not just hold it there? :confused:

[mrbass]

Best thing I've ever seen on wow and done it myself since it ain't illegal is get about 5 or so horde into IronForge. Soon enough there'll be 25+ alliance trying to kill em. They never will kill them (ok once or twice but that's it) cuz hop on my alliance priest with my druid healing buddy. I mind control the horde (I'm a traitor and so is my buddy) who is about to die and my druid buddy heals him. When mind controled nobody can do jack squat but sit there and watch him get fully healed. Spam a gm all you want cuz it ain't illegal and it's in the spirit of pvp. Never knew what happened to Candy till just now. Good thing I don't visit the lounge all that often.

[pharmx]

Now I may not be the nicest person, and my humor is VERY VERY crude (You know, dead baby jokes, racism, things that "cross the line", etc. it all makes me laugh) But when it comes to ****ing with someone who is actually dead IRL, at least give the deceased, and the ones who knew them at least 5 minutes of respect. And that means a funeral, if even on a f*cking video game, and even if it's silly. At least give them that. That's one more thing that would just make the people who are ALREADY GRIEVING worse.

I find it ironic that you laugh at dead baby jokes...

[istara]

I don't think being able to put up a link that drives traffic to a site is one of them though, no matter how useful the information might be.
You still don't get my motive - or rather, my lack of motive.

"Driving traffic" to a site implies some kind of commercial aim. I created the (ad-free) page solely as a resource. I thought about doing it on Wikipedia, but I didn't think that "iphone rpgs" would be an appropriate single-page topic for Wikipedia.

Let's assume it had been, and I wrote exactly the same list on Wikipedia, and posted that link here: would that have been wrong? Would I have received an infraction for posting a Wikipedia page that I had personally created?

I have no clue how many people may or may not visit my list. There is no stat counter on it (you can look at the code yourself) I only know that one person has visited because they commented, and I used their comment to expand the list. If it was a vanity project I could have put it in my signature by now: as you can see, I haven't even bothered to do that. All I posted was just a one off alert to people that a specific genre list of games was now available if they wanted it.

This site - Touch Arcade - is about "keeping you in touch with the latest in iPhone gaming". That's entirely what my list was about - except it was specifically RPGs.

[jchampl]

as long as the link you are posting is not a link to YOUR site, then it is fine, if you are the owner of wikipedia, then no you can not. if it is not yours, then post away. youtube, wikipedia. etc are all fine. you can not drive traffic to your own site regardless of topic, or content.

[pharmx]

You still don't get my motive - or rather, my lack of motive.

"Driving traffic" to a site implies some kind of commercial aim. I created the (ad-free) page solely as a resource. I thought about doing it on Wikipedia, but I didn't think that "iphone rpgs" would be an appropriate single-page topic for Wikipedia.

Let's assume it had been, and I wrote exactly the same list on Wikipedia, and posted that link here: would that have been wrong? Would I have received an infraction for posting a Wikipedia page that I had personally created?

I have no clue how many people may or may not visit my list. There is no stat counter on it (you can look at the code yourself) I only know that one person has visited because they commented, and I used their comment to expand the list. If it was a vanity project I could have put it in my signature by now: as you can see, I haven't even bothered to do that. All I posted was just a one off alert to people that a specific genre list of games was now available if they wanted it.

This site - Touch Arcade - is about "keeping you in touch with the latest in iPhone gaming". That's entirely what my list was about - except it was specifically RPGs.

I understand exactly what you are saying. The problem is that not everyone has good intentions like you do. So it will have to be policed in some way. Who has time to do that? And if you want to be the exception to the rule...what happens when the next person wants to be the exception...and the next person....and the next? Try to look at the big picture here.

[Crypton]

Thanks for the explanation :D

But if there existed a server where you couldn't kill on a neutral area, why not just hold it there? :confused:

You cannot switch realms (servers) in WoW that easily. You have to pay (in real money) to Blizzard to do that. The only thing they could have done is create new chracters on a new realm. But that would mean start from scratch and grinding, grinding.... Boy, I'm glad I got rid of my WoW-addiction... at least I pretend to be :o

[istara]

as long as the link you are posting is not a link to YOUR site, then it is fine, if you are the owner of wikipedia, then no you can not. if it is not yours, then post away. youtube, wikipedia. etc are all fine. you can not drive traffic to your own site regardless of topic, or content.
Doesn't stop it being a stupid and illogical rule. If I really wanted to spam, I could (1) claim it was a link I'd "just stumbled across" and/or (2) set up about ten fake accounts on here posting the link all over the place.

The honesty makes it more legitimate, in my opinon. Everything I wrote was honest and accurate and not in any way misleading (though that thread got deleted, so you only have my word for that).

[Eli]

Doesn't stop it being a stupid and illogical rule. If I really wanted to spam, I could (1) claim it was a link I'd "just stumbled across" and/or (2) set up about ten fake accounts on here posting the link all over the place.

The honesty makes it more legitimate, in my opinon. Everything I wrote was honest and accurate and not in any way misleading (though that thread got deleted, so you only have my word for that).

Do you realize over half your posts since you registered here have consisted of complaining about the rules?

[Boardumb]

This site - Touch Arcade - is about "keeping you in touch with the latest in iPhone gaming". That's entirely what my list was about - except it was specifically RPGs.

First of all, I have no idea why I just read through this entire thread. I must be really bored at work. Second of all, and I may be totally missing something here, but why wouldn't you just create that list in a thread here on TA?

[DaveMc99]

Do you seriously think that someone would do hard work in good faith and community spirit, be insulted and accused of "self-promotion" in response, and then give you my work for free on your own, commercial site?

I may be totally missing something here, but why wouldn't you just create that list in a thread here on TA?

He does not want to give his work out for free.

[Boardumb]

He does not want to give his work out for free.

Oh, ummmm, ok. But... the OP is not receiving money from people visiting the site he DID post it on (according to him) so I'm still not so sure I understand. Bah, I'll stop trying to figure this out, it makes my brain hurt. I really don't understand some of the things people complain about though. This whole things seems like not a big deal, but that's just me.

[HJJ]

Oh, ummmm, ok. But... the OP is not receiving money from people visiting the site he DID post it on (according to him) so I'm still not so sure I understand. Bah, I'll stop trying to figure this out, it makes my brain hurt. I really don't understand some of the things people complain about though. This whole things seems like not a big deal, but that's just me.

He got his feelings hurt and won't let it go. That's about all that's going on at this point. I think we all understand that he tried to do a nice thing with no self serving motives, but he fails to understand that this policy is not some random power grab by the admins -- it's simply a necessity in this environment.

[dogmeat]

Maybe you should have read the rules the first time, and you wouldn't be so upset when the site reacts to you breaking them.

I spent time and effort today creating a comprehensive list of iPhone RPGs. It was put on a completely non-commercial, ad-free site (on tumblr, just because it was free, quick and convenient for me). I did this solely for the benefit of other RPG fans. I put a link to it on here - and wham! the thread was deleted and I got something called an "infraction point".

This is a truly pathetic policy. If I had put up a link to a commercial, non-game-related, spammy, malware ridden site then fair enough. But I didn't. The page that I created and linked to was intended to be a useful resource. It even linked back to relevant game threads on TouchArcade and other third-party sites where there was useful information about the game.

And then I was told in a private message that I could instead "paste" my work into a thread on your site!!! I mean are you joking? Do you seriously think that someone would do hard work in good faith and community spirit, be insulted and accused of "self-promotion" in response, and then give you my work for free on your own, commercial site?

You guys seriously need to take a good hard look at yourselves and your policies! Because this is absolutely pathetic.

[reinhart_menken]

Moderators should operate with discretion and intelligence, not just blindly follow policy that acts - at least in this instance - against the interest of site members.

You must have modded a very unconventional and lenient or small forum or something, but you clearly have not been on the big sites (either that or you just have a really big problem with adapting and getting a grip - as evidence shows).

You fail to understand that moderators are "hired" or picked or whatever specifically to be robots (when I say hired I don't mean it in the conventional sense where money is involved). They're not hired because of their winning personality or their overwhelming logic and reasoning or even intelligence, they're hired - most of the time - for their ability to enforce rules in a draconian fashion - exactly to follow the rules blindly. They are to exercise their power like an Old Testament God (and in this forum they're not even that, they only just gave you an infraction).

And I mean no offense when I describe that job description; somebody has to do it.

It's a common unspoken rule (a lot of times even spelled out clearly) that 1. Moderators are always right, 2. Don't argue with a mod publicly in a public forum (meaning = PM) 3. Moderators are always right.

It is already pretty lenient that this thread got as far as even page 2. Other forums wouldn't even so much as allow you to speak about rules that were enforced (so no talking about being banned, no talking about getting an infraction).

Plus, if they were to make exceptions then it might be seen as favoritism. I'm pretty sure even if the RED CROSS came here to promote their site the thread would swiftly deleted or locked as well - because it's the bots' jobs.

I mean, think about what they have to do - delete ads, change thread titles, lock threads, prevent possible flame wars or stop flame bait, etc etc. They don't have time to stop and have an inner philosophical debate about "oh, does this apply?" That would make them inefficient. Everything that breaks the rules apply.

The only time they are wrong is when they just go psycho and do something like go on a delete spree and delete all the threads in a forum...and sometimes not even that's enough.

I like mods in forums that just give you only one warning (legitimate) and after that just go "shut the hole up and go back to what you were doing" (I've seen that).

...snip...

Infraction points though: that's just another story. That is really pre-school, hall-monitor style modding. Infantile stuff.

Like CDubby94 said, no it's no infantile. Our country's DMV uses a point-deduction (or addition or whatever) system. Or, you can flip it, and say it's infantile because people are infantile, hence we need stupid measures people can grasp.

Now, with all this being said, understand I'm not trying to attack you. I'm just trying to make you understand.

We know that you're prolly just doing it out of goodwill; and like a lot of other people have said, you could easily just make a thread and publish the list there. You said the mods should exercise intelligence - use yours. It doesn't make a whole lot of difference if you just follow the rules and just publish the list on the forum instead of linking to it. Saves you the time getting mad about it, save the mods time having to lock it, save us the time needed to accumulate 7 pages.

The reason linking to your blog (someone said that on the earlier pages) or whatever your site is, is seen as traffic-driving even though there are no counters, is because that's like advertising (and don't pretend like you think people only advertise when there's money involved). Even though there are no content, what you did can be construed as encouraging people to go back and check it later, hence trying to make your site be seen more.

[Simbazz]

I've been following this thread, and i've been/are a member of a hell of a lot of forums. Created one or two as well.

The thing which people need to realise, although the iDevices are real things, this is merely an online forum, something to while away the time, and in the mean-time, find out about something you guys are interested in.

I'm not a fan of the infractions, but I live with it because, to be honest, who really cares? Its not like me getting infracted is going to change my day.

I think people need to take stock and realise how unbelievably difficult running a forum is. Rules are there to be followed, and on this site, especially, it'd be damn difficult to think, "hmmm...maybe i'll use common sense here and wave the punishment," because as soon as you do it for one, its only fair you do it for all.

To sum up this rant,

Grow up, its an online forum, rules are there to be followed, don't like it, leave.

I know I'm new here, just seen a lot of this over the years.

[reinhart_menken]

It was actually so interesting for me to see a thread like this that I read the whole thing, partly because the forums I used to go to it's either immediately locked or (in another forum) you get a "shut your hole up and get a grip". So it's rare for me to see discussion about a punishment :p Plus I was bored.

[worldcup1100]

http://forums.toucharcade.com/showthread.php?t=8910

I think it was locked also because of her reaction to people criticizing her. It ended up in a big flame war, which led to her reporting all of them against her poem =/

I had never read the thread before now, but I must say many of you were VERY insensitive about that issue.

It may have been the wrong place to say what she did but no one deserves to get flamed for grieving a lost loved one.

[The Bat Outta Hell]

I had never read the thread before now, but I must say many of you were VERY insensitive about that issue.

It may have been the wrong place to say what she did but no one deserves to get flamed for grieving a lost loved one.


Nobody flamed her in the beginning, just questioned her actions. She got pissed, which got everyone else started.

[worldcup1100]

Nobody flamed her in the beginning, just questioned her actions. She got pissed, which got everyone else started.

Yes, but everyone could have kept that to themselves, and understood how hard it is to for her, a little better.

[The Bat Outta Hell]

Yes, but everyone could have kept that to themselves, and understood how hard it is to for her, a little better.

You know what's ironic though? She could've kept that poem to herself.

[worldcup1100]

You know what's ironic though? She could've kept that poem to herself.

Very true, that was just all in all a VERY delicate topic, that she really shouldn't have brought here.
I mean what reaction did she expect? Guys are not exactly known for their great sensitivity...

[Simbazz]

Very true, that was just all in all a VERY delicate topic, that she really shouldn't have brought here.
I mean what reaction did she expect? Guys are not exactly known for their great sensitivity...

Thats where I've been going wrong with the ladies, so is crying over a dead pigeon not good? :p

[super6ft7]

You know what's ironic though? She could've kept that poem to herself.

thats not ironic, thats just a fact. If people are going to use words please can they know how!

Anyway, on topic. The OP's argument is pointless, so you don't want to paste your work into this forum, but you want to help people. You also say that the website you host it on has no adverts or anything, so why would you care.

And semi on-topic, how do you become a mod, do you just have to frequently and lawfully use a forum and prove that you are willing to help. It sounds good to be a mod, but I probably don't use the forums enough.

[The Bat Outta Hell]

thats not ironic, thats just a fact. If people are going to use words please can they know how!

Anyway, on topic. The OP's argument is pointless, so you don't want to paste your work into this forum, but you want to help people. You also say that the website you host it on has no adverts or anything, so why would you care.

And semi on-topic, how do you become a mod, do you just have to frequently and lawfully use a forum and prove that you are willing to help. It sounds good to be a mod, but I probably don't use the forums enough.

It's ironic in that worldcup said that the people who responded to her should not have said anything at all, and yet she shouldn't have said anything either.

[CDubby94]

It's ironic how much you use the word ironic.

[The Bat Outta Hell]

It's ironic how much you use the word ironic.

Twice? :confused:

[CDubby94]

Twice? :confused:

Haha I guess but it was only used once the right way. You're shooting fifty percent buddy.

[pharmx]

I used ironic in this thread too :(

[The Bat Outta Hell]

Haha I guess but it was only used once the right way. You're shooting fifty percent buddy.

I feel dumb =(

[CandyNJ66]

The problem with things like that is that one must remember the internet is filled with people who don't care about other people's feelings. Making posts in a public forum (be it a lounge or not) about something so personal is very risky unless the forum is dedicated to the subject matter. A better way of going about what she did would have been to Twitter, LiveJournal, or even place it in her Sig. Starting a whole thread just attracts the forum stalkers and they can't help but +1 their post count by chiming in.


That being said I also think it's a weird thread. :(

About the WoW Funeral thing....they picked a PVP zone. They seriously were asking for it by having the E-funeral there. The Temple of Elune in Darnassus is pretty enough so why not have it there where flocks of horde are less likely to barge in? Pretty silly if you ask me.

To be a little more back on topic, though I suppose the whole Candythread incident pertains to infractions in a way.... Why not copy/paste at least *SOME* of the content from the page you set up and then direct people to the link in your signature if they want to see more of it? Maybe that isn't allowed either I don't know. It's a great thing that communities like this prohibit things like that because it would get out of hand so fast. Who do you approve/deny? What's the grey area? Better to just disallow it entirely.

Why the living hell are you talking about me for? That forum was for discussion about anything. This whole forum is run by apes with no brains and filled with mods like hodapp who couldn't think his way out of a paper bag. Filled with mean spirited children who have nothing better to do than pick on others because their life sucks.

I don't come here for a reason, this forum is ridiculous and only a few nice people are left. I came here because my name was mentioned and I responded. Thank god I won't be sticking around for the ramblings of the insane.

[The Bat Outta Hell]

Why the living hell are you talking about me for? That forum was for discussion about anything. This whole forum is run by apes with no brains and filled with mods like hodapp who couldn't think his way out of a paper bag. Filled with mean spirited children who have nothing better to do than pick on others because their life sucks.

I don't come here for a reason, this forum is ridiculous and only a few nice people are left. I came here because my name was mentioned and I responded. Thank god I won't be sticking around for the ramblings of the insane.



Yes, thank god indeed.