3D iPhone MMO (+ Mac/PC) in Development

[daveyoung]

This has been an exciting summer! A new baby for me, born on 9/11/09, and the release of my third solo game (Arcana: Spell Duel) on 9/12/09. I'm quite proud of both :)

It also marks the time when I decide to get a team together to work on a game that we've been wanting to make for a long time. The timing is perfect. I'm between updates for Arcana and CastleGuard2. Working alone is great sometimes, but you really miss having some help when companies like Gameloft are cranking out really nice and well-polished titles. My art skills are somewhere between non-existent and horrendous after all, and I've had a rough time getting by on my own. It's time to raise that bar, a thousandfold.

It is therefore my pleasure to announce:

New 3D iPhone MMO in Development
A new MMO with the working title 'Gryphon' is currently in development. This MMO is being built from the ground up as a cross-platform MMO. This is not the "text and pictures" style game that is prevalent in the App Store now, but a full 3D real time online game: with everything you would expect from (yesterday's) and today's Massively Multiplayer Online games, and more.


massive areas to explore
quests
immersive and strategic combat
brilliant spells and spell effects
skill-based character system
full array of stats and leveling to create a unique character
online chat and emotes
diverse crafting: perfect for casual play or long term play investment
property ownership
thousands of inventory items
build your own section of the world and influence the main story
unique gameplay elements not found anywhere else
staged releases, with new features being added with each new release


A key differentiator for Gryphon is that it is being developed from scratch with an iPhone client and casual gameplay in mind. So, while you can play at home on your Mac or PC, you can also play using your iPhone using 3G or WiFi, your iPod Touch using WiFi, or even your favorite web browser! There will be additional platforms developed in the future. This cross-platform design will let you take the game as seriously as you want to, wherever you want to!

The development team is using a rapid prototype and development release cycle which will facilitate an organic growth model in response to user demands and overall story arc vision. This means frequent releases and content updates focusing on key gameplay features in a manageable way, giving the players something new to look forward to each release.

Who is the team behind Gryphon?
They are a motley band of foolhardy gamers and Indie developers who have created a secret club and handshake to do something which moves quickly and sweepingly into your daily life. Small, but powerful. Like Yoda. If forced to answer the question "What is the game going to be like", they might say something like this: "Our unofficial Gameplay Influences are games like Asheron's Call and World of Warcraft, and the art team is heavily influenced by brands such as Lego, Dr Seuss, and the Muppets.. which are trademarked and copyrighted of their respective owners, of course."

What is the Story of Gryphon?
Rumor has it that the design team has accidentally discovered an interdimensional window to a parallel universe and is focused on recording and making drawings of the things they see going on there, which serve as inspiration for the game. There's no telling when the window will close, so this is a very busy time indeed!

One thing is clear. This story has never been told, and it's going to take quite some time and many episodes to do it. You..the player.. will have a part to play in it

As in the thread for my previous game Arcana: Spell Duel, I will keep this thread fresh with updates and screenshots and info as we progress.

Right now we are about at the point where we're deciding what will go into the initial release and plotting out the map to get to initial release in early November. The World/Story Team and the Art Team are about formed up, and the Development Team is close behind.

[emp]

Sounss amazing. Any guess to the date of release or BETA release?

[dragmor]

wow that sounds crazy

[CaseyLay]

HAHAHAHAHA You're baby was born on 9/11!:D
I would be laughing my ass off if you had twins.

[weedeatinflyincougar]

will it have single player?
any screenshots/videos at this point? if not, how soon will you be able to post some?

[JoshCM]

this sounds pretty interesting! it sounds like you haven't started it yet and plan to release in November? Or did I read that wrong?
Anyway - looking forward to it!

[Aldex Oun]

Well if you guys are looking for Beta testers, count me in ;).

[JoshCM]

Will it really look like a combination of Lego, Dr. Seuss and the Muppets?
I'd like to see a photoshop mashup of that!

[SoCal_Sponger]

sounds good dave, I'd be very interested in an MMO from you (and now your team)!

[daveyoung]

Yes, it has begun, if unofficially. If you are familiar with any of my previous games, you could maybe put together that I've been developing RPG elements all year... combat, weapons, quests, NPCs, spells, special effects, networking code, etc.

So I actually have quite a bit prototyped already. The initial release will contain a core amount of gameplay (focused around online PvP probably), and we're using a short development cycle for each subsequent release. My previous experience with Indie dev teams is that sometimes life gets in the way, so it's best to keep it going in short bursts.

Our first development cycle starts October 1st, and will be focused on the set of features that can be finished for a November release. In the meantime, we're designing and planning while the world team is peeping into the alternate universe. I've got a clean codebase up and running, and realtime multiplayer engine is up and running.

I *will* put up a screenie/vid soon.. it will be a hoot to watch a game being built from square one to a finished product, like I did right here for Arcana. Fun for us anyway :)

[daveyoung]

HAHAHAHAHA You're baby was born on 9/11!:D
I would be laughing my ass off if you had twins.

Yes, it was actually a pretty *freaky* thing. It wasn't planned this way, and in a truly bizarre twist of subconscious numerology, the 9:11 time has been standing out on the clock for me quite a bit all year long, whereas I never really took notice of it before. I looked into it, and it's a fairly known phenomenon of numerology and your subconscious mind or some such.

I always joked that the baby would be born then (early) but I didn't actually think it would happen. I'm glad it did though, a ray of sunshine on a cloudy day and all that.

[pharmx]

Dave as always you have my support, I am consistently impressed with your work, especially since I see where at least part of the influence is coming from. I have a question about the realtime multiplayer aspect. How did you solve the carrier based connectivity issue? Or is it going to be mostly wifi/bluetooth?

[daveyoung]

I have a question about the realtime multiplayer aspect. How did you solve the carrier based connectivity issue? Or is it going to be mostly wifi/bluetooth?

This is an excellent question. It's definitely a forefront technical design consideration and pretty much the first problem I needed to overcome. I don't mind sharing that I experimented some to find a solution, because I actually kind of did it 'out loud' here:
Blog Post 1 (http://daveyounggames.com/?p=183)
and here:
Blog Post 2 (http://daveyounggames.com/?p=185).

To sum up... the iPhone as an online gaming device (and this is an online-only game) can't support both reasonable amounts of networked objects AND playable network usage. So I am experimenting with a click-to-move style of movement combined with fine-tune movement controls. This comes with the major advantage of freeing up screen space used by movement interfaces as well. The network usage of this system is dramatically smaller than one driven from keys/joystick, is much less prone to error over the network, and leaves lots of bandwidth for other things.

So far it feels fantastic, especially on the larger terrains and inside buildings.

[Fletch]

Wow, this sounds great dave!

It'll be cool to see everything you've been working on culminating into one awesome sounding mmo game. Can't wait to hear/see more about this

p.s. It's doubly awesome that Lego is part of the inspiration for the art :)

[daveyoung]

Just a quick update as to what to expect and when: this week I'll be delivering most of the over-arcing game vision to the teams and we'll be finalizing the feature list for the initial release. There will be wild speculation and grand posturing as well no doubt.

Many folks are inquiring about alpha/beta access, and I assure you that I or someone else on the team will clearly announce it here when we are ready for that. I'll also Twitter about it :) I can say that there will most likely be a decent-sized fan beta for the web-based client, and then an even more closely held beta for the iPhone client itself.

[Brazilian Rider]

I helped test for Arcana... does that mean I get a freebie in? :p

[LBG]

HAHAHAHAHA You're baby was born on 9/11!:D
I would be laughing my ass off if you had twins.

You are always the one to make 9/11 jokes, lol.
May I ask why?

Are you secretly working for Al Quaeda, investigating US people's lifestyles, and planning to devastate the world's population by hacking into the App Store and deleting all the apps? Then demanding money, weapons and ultimately freedom to the people of the middle east, in return for apps?
Is your name 'Akmed Mohammed Abdellah Sanjib Khalid' by any chance?

..... just a thought :p

[Goose]

i await with brimming excitement.

[TheBeastlyNinja]

Me too!

[daveyoung]

I helped test for Arcana... does that mean I get a freebie in? :p

Yes, of course! It makes it easier that I already have your device information, *and* that you actually participated :)

[ShadowsFall]

HAHAHAHAHA You're baby was born on 9/11!:D
I would be laughing my ass off if you had twins.

A bit harsh I do believe, I thought people were supposed to congratulate other people for the birth of their baby/babies. Well I congratulate you for hacing a baby!

I'm finially excited to see a major development coming along so greatly. The game reminds me of Outer-Empires, both using a web browser + ipod/iphone for a MMO, though this one is going to be a MMORPG, which is a big thumbs up in the App Store. I'm thinking that the release date for this game is probably going to be in march 2010 because of the massive online 3D world.

[CaseyLay]

Yes, it was actually a pretty *freaky* thing. It wasn't planned this way, and in a truly bizarre twist of subconscious numerology, the 9:11 time has been standing out on the clock for me quite a bit all year long, whereas I never really took notice of it before. I looked into it, and it's a fairly known phenomenon of numerology and your subconscious mind or some such.

I always joked that the baby would be born then (early) but I didn't actually think it would happen. I'm glad it did though, a ray of sunshine on a cloudy day and all that.

Whoa. I've actually been seeing 9:11 stand out on the clock for over a year now.

Well, anyway, I can't wait to see the game. How good will the graphics be? I hope for a lot of good desert/snow places. As learned from Perfect World, those always seem to be the prettiest environments.

[Brazilian Rider]

Whoa. I've actually been seeing 9:11 stand out on the clock for over a year now.

Well, anyway, I can't wait to see the game. How good will the graphics be? I hope for a lot of good desert/snow places. As learned from Perfect World, those always seem to be the prettiest environments.

:eek: Same Here!

[daveyoung]

Google it with the words 9:11 clock digital, pretty weird stuff. Though it won't be any part of the gameplay of our game :) Just spent a couple hours peering through the looking glass and getting a bunch of notes together for the design team, wow! good stuff happening

[daveyoung]

A small bit of news: we have moved from the working title of 'Gryphon' to an official game name of 'DangerLands'.

After peering though the portal into the game world for awhile, we could see no sign of Gryphons. Someone could swear that they saw one a couple years ago, but darned if any of the rest of us have seen any on our watch, so it just doesn't make sense.

So, though we've been waiting for crazy flying Gryphons to show up, what IS apparent is that these lands are filled with danger and old-skool adventure. Also, the portal is showing us strange glimpses of what seems to be both the past and the future of this world.

The design team has been working in shifts looking through the portal and trying to overhear things. Audio quality is just plain poor, but they have managed to pick up some small bursts of words.

Many of the inhabitants of this land speak in an entirely foreign tongue. One of the designers says it resembles Latin, but I dunno.. mama didn't raise no fancy college gradumate.

In addition, there is a large variety of creatures here. Some are almost intelligent, and some are no more than beasts. We overheard some names of the creatures. In particular, there are some beasts which seem to command quite a bit of fear to the people. We think they are called 'Grog' and 'Borogroth', and we keep hearing mention of a rather dreaded 'Bask'.

There is also one rather disturbing piece of news. It wasn't immediately apparent given all the excitement of discovering the alternate dimension, and we can only see from pretty far off after all, but the inhabitants here seem to be able to CHANGE HEADS! Yes, yes, I know.. you think I'm mad now. It's true. I personally witnessed a young man go into a shop wearing a helmet, and come out with what looked like a bear head. At first I thought it was a mask, but then I realized that he never took it off. And many of the other people were doing the same thing.

One of the designers has managed to translate the sign on the shop, and it seems to say... 'Head Shop'.

Well, that is all for now, my shift to watch is almost here. We are going to continue to look and gather information for the rest of the week, and then we will put what we have seen and heard into play, and get cranking on the game!

[JoshCM]

Personally I liked Gryphon better - I hope you aren't fully decided on that yet.
Dangerlands sounds a bit generic - this is just some constructive criticism.
Please think that over a bit more. Maybe start a poll and let some of the folks here suggest a name? Or at least vote on one?

[daveyoung]

It used to fit quite well when we started a team project two years ago, but it somehow doesn't fit the cross-genre multi-dimensional game that is taking form here. The target demographic is also wider than the competitive fantasy RPG audience.

Most of us are old school role players who remember the vintage and classic pen and paper excitement of Dangerous Journeys and Dungeons and Dragons... and played with things like Adventure People and Legos.

So we're going to capture all that as best we can, and expose it to a new generation too :)

[kazcat42]

Personally I liked Gryphon better - I hope you aren't fully decided on that yet.
Dangerlands sounds a bit generic - this is just some constructive criticism.
Please think that over a bit more. Maybe start a poll and let some of the folks here suggest a name? Or at least vote on one?

+1 though it is up to you devs :D

[daveyoung]

I do very much appreciate the feedback (it's why I'm here) and don't want to sound ungrateful at all for the constructive advice either!

I hope when more of the story and style come out that the game name is more justifiable to you. It would feel funny to be someday playing a game named Gryphon in a wide brim hat and taking aim with a revolver. Similarly, one might become uneasy never seeing any Gryphons around. There is, however, a good deal of danger to be had. *shudders*

[daveyoung]

Or perhaps it is better to say:

"WHOSE RESPONSIBLE THIS? I am what they call the best of the best, so mock all you want, but I have my fans, and they lvoe my stories!!!!"

[Baitntackle54]

Wow just what everyonw with an iPhone and iPod touch is looking for. First real massive 3d MMO. I'm way excited! I got alot of questions so answer what you can :)

will there be different races and playable classes and will we be able to have multiple characters on an account?

Will questing be a major part of the game? Will there be quests where you need multiple players too help you beat it? Will questing be a good way too level up or will there be alot of "grinding" involved?

Is there alot of teamplay such as alliances, clans, being able to train together?

What kind of monsters can we expect too see? Will there be raid monsters too?

Can we turn into monsters ourselves with certain spells and maybe even be able too fly around?

What will the level cap be? Will we be able too pick from a number of professions for how we make money?

When could we expect to maybe get some screenshots?

[daveyoung]

I will answer your questions in order :) We are also extremely excited! A lot has been put up on the drawing board.

Q: Will there be different races and playable classes and will we be able to have multiple characters on an account?
A: There will be different playable races, but we only have one on the drawing board so far. I can't say how many there will be or what they will be called, because we don't know yet. It's not difficult to add them codewise, but it means more art.

As far as playable classes go, there won't be locked-in classes, but rather there will be skills. You can choose a set of predefined skills as a 'class template'.

For example, if you choose the 'Fangler' template, you can expect to have a specialized skill in 'Fangling'. That is, of course, the name of our sword skill. Here are the names of some of the player templates, see if you can figure out which correspond to what type of character:
Lobber, Ganker, Fangler, Fizzler

You will be able to have multiple characters on your account.


Q: Will questing be a major part of the game? Will there be quests where you need multiple players too help you beat it? Will questing be a good way too level up or will there be alot of "grinding" involved?
A: There will be both quests and grinding for those that want it. I enjoy exploring and hunting, myself. There will be other gameplay elements to help you level, which are fairly unique so we'll keep em secret for awhile. Questing is always a good way to level up, and I imagine there will be many different types of quests, some may indeed involve groups! We are trying to create a great gameplay experience for the casual/occasional player as well as the hardcore folks.


Q: Is there alot of teamplay such as alliances, clans, being able to train together?
A: There will be alliances, and we will use an allegiance system where you gain subjects/followers. When one of your subjects earns experience, you will also earn some experience.


Q: What kind of monsters can we expect too see? Will there be raid monsters too?
A: These are the kinds of monsters you can expect to see, which are a few from the drawing board of our World-Building team:


Grog: A semi-intelligent species which is prone to having bigger types, ranging up to under Huge. They have two small tusks jutting out from their lower lip, giving them a somewhat comical appearance. When they're not trying to eat you that is...
Redcap Grog: Some particularly fierce and fast-moving Grog which have blood colored skull caps. Associated with particularly nasty deeds and rumors
Swarthy Grog of the Southern Pass: One of many different local varieties of Grog
Borogroth (aka Pounder): An ancient race of ridiculously strong, non-intelligent nasty hairy beasts with long arms and a spiked cap. Sort of like a gorilla... and a bear
Bask: A man-sized and larger two-legged wild lizard. Sort of like a longer two-legged alligator but with a shorter snout. Some versions breathe fire. They're extremely aggressive and territorial


There will also be rare and unique monsters which get played by GMs or are used for special events only.


Q: Can we turn into monsters ourselves with certain spells and maybe even be able too fly around?
A: There is a very special kind of gameplay involving player-run monsters which no one has ever done before, and in fact I haven't even told the team about it yet. More on that later, when the time comes! That being said, certain players may always have a monstrous appearance ;)

Flying is *not* planned, there have to be certain limitations on movement due to the capabilities of our target platforms and networking. For now, anyway.


Q: What will the level cap be?
A: It's too early to say, we haven't discussed it at all yet. It would depend on many factors, and sometimes content and strategy too.


Q: Will we be able too pick from a number of professions for how we make money?
A: If you mean crafting, yes. I think it's an important part of a casual gameplay experience!


Q: When could we expect to maybe get some screenshots?
A: We're working on it. Showing preliminary screenshots now of prototyping various systems isn't that useful to folks. The first screenshot we will probably send out is one of the first playable area, which is being worked on now. They will come quickly after that, as our preliminary target goal to get out the first playable release is early November. This will be an extremely limited release, probably mostly focusing on PvP.

Thanks for the questions, keep em coming!

[hardcoregamer]

I'm looking forward to this game, but one thing that I would hate would be having to choose a profession. PLEASE go RuneScape style and let players level up in many professions and not make us choose! lol Thanks.

[daveyoung]

You have skills, not a profession. So you level up your skills. What we *will* have are player templates so people can put together something traditional if they want, with recommended stat and attribute values. But you can customize always and add new skills as you gain exp, or begin right from the start with a completely customized package. This will let you build and try out lots of different skill combinations, like a Ganker/Fizzler type.

It's going to be very similar to what you could do (and still can) in Asheron's Call

[Baitntackle54]

Wow you actually answered alot more then I expected thats awsome! I like that your open too answering all these. I hate the companys who wont release any information and just keep you guessing. And I really like how your doing stuff never done before that's great! I can't wait too see this game come together you have sure caught my attention. I'll think of some more good questions an post them later. Keep up the work!

[nooobynick]

A bit late to the topic but am looking forward to some screenshots.

[ShadowsFall]

List of questions to make it easier =P

-What's the name of the game?

-What do you mean by Property Ownership? Is that able to own a farm/house?

-Is there going to be a list of spells we could use as shortcuts?

-Is there going to be many jobs/quests? Is there going to be several towns or just one town to spawn in?

-Is there going to be a chat box (in-game chat, world chat [speaking out in the whole entire mmo world])?

-Can we add items to our swords/armour?

-Is there going to be cool magic skillz that would show when you use the skill?
-Is there a party system?

-Is there going to be a help guide?

-Ability to ride horses or make traveling easier?

-Any "resting" ability if you run out of potions?

-A mini-map/full map?

-Weather? (rain,fog,snow,etc.)

-Combining weapons/armour?

-Friends list?

-Alliance list?

-Release date? (at least a guess)

And things we Toucharcade members can help out out with!!
-Control Schemes
-Quest names/how you do the quest
-Naming monsters
-Naming NPC's

Looking forward to a MMORPG game =)

[Kunning]

It's my opinion that Dave's games are on a steady climb upwards in quality! If you guys like the idea of this game, I think you should check out Arcana: Spell Duel! :D

[Baitntackle54]

Ok i'm just guessing on some of this cause your giving me names and terms that i have no idea what they mean. I like that your moving from the generic wizard warrior cleric to stuff like that. And i Like the idea of kinda creating your own class type thing.

So anyways with the templates and stuff can you go deeper on that? From what i'm getting You put attribute points too certain skills like spellcasting or melee and thats how you character is made. With that though can you eventually get it so your good at all of them or by going with one skill you have too sacrifice another?

Can you give me an impression of how big you plan actually world too be? Is it gonna be segregated off into zones? and will we have underground cave and dungeons?

And with armor some games kinda go cheap with the armor and you don't even see all the stuff your wearing. Will we have different plate, leather, and cloth armors? and be able too tell the difference by the shape? like with plate you will see the different pieces. and with a robe you will actually see a robe skirt and cape? I can't stand it when i'm stuck with a bodysuit that never changes shape and only the outside texture and colors change haha :P

And from what it sounds like with npcs. It will be more of fighting certain races then just random monsters across the world?

will the game be a pay per month type deal or do we buy expansions as they come out? I personally like it how guild wars has it and you buy the expansions but if you don't have the money you can stick with what you have. As long as they are quality expansions and not overpriced or rushed.

Will we be able too summon pets to assist us in combat?

I think thats all i can think of for now. I dunno how much actually relates too the game cause it sounds like your taking it in a differen't direction. But i think those are the general questions someones gonna ask about a mmo.

[daveyoung]

What's the name of the game?
DangerLands (see influences earlier in the thread to see why)

What do you mean by Property Ownership? Is that able to own a farm/house?
That is what it means: having control over ingame properties for various purposes/reasons

Is there going to be a list of spells we could use as shortcuts?
We will have a customizable action bar for you to drag spells/actions to, and the menus you'd need to get to full lists. The iPhone version of the game will have a tighter interface to save on screen space, the full sized version will be easier to use I would think as it shows more at once.

Is there going to be many jobs/quests?
That's game content, we will continue to build the game with monthly (4-6 week) dev cycles and episodic content

Is there going to be several towns or just one town to spawn in?
Several, and you will spawn into where you logged out of last, town or not!

Is there going to be a chat box (in-game chat, world chat [speaking out in the whole entire mmo world])?
It is doubtful we will have world chat, but you will have area chat at the very least, as well as character emotes to use. We also have a cool feature planned where people on the website can talk to people ingame using normal chat system

Can we add items to our swords/armour?
Not at the beginning, this is a late-stage feature we could consider down the road.

Is there going to be cool magic skillz that would show when you use the skill?
Special effects! We got 'em!

Is there a party system?
Yes

Is there going to be a help guide?
Yes

Ability to ride horses or make traveling easier?
Not horses (they aren't actually in the game world at all from what we've seen).
Teleporting devices will be around to help you get from place to place. We haven't decided if we will be building riding in, it might not make sense once you see things...

Any "resting" ability if you run out of potions?
Characters regain health and other critical energies naturally over time

A mini-map/full map?
Full map yes, mini-map... probably!

Weather? (rain,fog,snow,etc.)
Yes

Combining weapons/armour?
If you mean mixmatching, you will have a full inventory available to swap pieces in and out of.

Friends list?
Yes

Alliance list?
Yes, and other functions available for alliance use

Release date? (at least a guess)
We are shooting for an early November release for the preliminary game client which will focus on PvP mostly. We will then proceed with a 4-6 week development plan for each update, adding in features and content as we go!

[randomdude]

Alliance Wars? Like one alliance attacks another at a sneak attack at a base or something

[daveyoung]

So anyways with the templates and stuff can you go deeper on that? From what i'm getting You put attribute points too certain skills like spellcasting or melee and thats how you character is made. With that though can you eventually get it so your good at all of them or by going with one skill you have too sacrifice another?

You will buy your skills with points, and that will raise their starting values and also affect how much exp they need to raise. They will raise as they are used, and you can speed this up by assigning exp you earn to skills also. As you gain skill points you can get more skills, and indeed you can keep levelling up and get all the skills eventually. That would take a ridiculous amount of time though, so it's highly unlikely. You can still use a skill even if it's untrained, unless it's an unusable type. If you decide at creation time to specialize in a skill, it will begin with an even higher value, and go up even quicker than a trained skills. You can't specialize after creation though, so that really dictates what you'd be using most often/the type of character you are.


Can you give me an impression of how big you plan actually world too be? Is it gonna be segregated off into zones? and will we have underground cave and dungeons?
It will be segregated off into zones, there will be underground areas and underwater areas too, no doubt. As far as how big it will be, it's designed to grow infinitely large, and there is a special gameplay element that relates to this, and I'm not saying what it is yet!


And with armor some games kinda go cheap with the armor and you don't even see all the stuff your wearing. Will we have different plate, leather, and cloth armors? and be able too tell the difference by the shape? like with plate you will see the different pieces. and with a robe you will actually see a robe skirt and cape? I can't stand it when i'm stuck with a bodysuit that never changes shape and only the outside texture and colors change haha :P

There's a good reason for that: performance. No one likes lag, or needing a super beefy PC to play every game. Which is a big concern on the iPhone, obviously. But for our needs, you will see all the major changes happen to the character. We are optimizing our visual and character design for the lower performing devices, so we won't be needing to show a zillion pieces, it's much more of a toy-look than WoW is, for example.


And from what it sounds like with npcs. It will be more of fighting certain races then just random monsters across the world?
There will be players, and many types of monsters to fight. There will be lots of random monsters out there to hunt, and some may be a big part of the storyline and be intelligent!


will the game be a pay per month type deal or do we buy expansions as they come out? I personally like it how guild wars has it and you buy the expansions but if you don't have the money you can stick with what you have. As long as they are quality expansions and not overpriced or rushed.

I don't think we're going after a subscription model just yet in the same manner. What we will have is downloadable content, and we may also have a monthly plan available for that as well. There will be new episodic content every dev cycle (4-6) weeks to add features and advance the storyline, these won't be paid updates, they come with the game.

So anyways with the templates and stuff can you go deeper on that? From what i'm getting You put attribute points too certain skills like spellcasting or melee and thats how you character is made. With that though can you eventually get it so your good at all of them or by going with one skill you have too sacrifice another?

You will buy your skills with points, and that will raise their starting values and also affect how much exp they need to raise. They will raise as they are used, and you can speed this up by assigning exp you earn to skills also. As you gain skill points you can get more skills, and indeed you can keep levelling up and get all the skills eventually. That would take a ridiculous amount of time though, so it's highly unlikely. You can still use a skill even if it's untrained, unless it's an unusable type. If you decide at creation time to specialize in a skill, it will begin with an even higher value, and go up even quicker than a trained skills. You can't specialize after creation though, so that really dictates what you'd be using most often/the type of character you are.


Can you give me an impression of how big you plan actually world too be? Is it gonna be segregated off into zones? and will we have underground cave and dungeons?
It will be segregated off into zones, there will be underground areas and underwater areas too, no doubt. As far as how big it will be, it's designed to grow infinitely large, and there is a special gameplay element that relates to this, and I'm not saying what it is yet!


And with armor some games kinda go cheap with the armor and you don't even see all the stuff your wearing. Will we have different plate, leather, and cloth armors? and be able too tell the difference by the shape? like with plate you will see the different pieces. and with a robe you will actually see a robe skirt and cape? I can't stand it when i'm stuck with a bodysuit that never changes shape and only the outside texture and colors change haha :P

There's a good reason for that: performance. No one likes lag, or needing a super beefy PC to play every game. Which is a big concern on the iPhone, obviously. But for our needs, you will see all the major changes happen to the character. We are optimizing our visual and character design for the lower performing devices, so we won't be needing to show a zillion pieces, it's much more of a toy-look than WoW is, for example.


And from what it sounds like with npcs. It will be more of fighting certain races then just random monsters across the world?
There will be players, and many types of monsters to fight. There will be lots of random monsters out there to hunt, and some may be a big part of the storyline and be intelligent!


Will we be able too summon pets to assist us in combat?

We haven't talked it over yet, but it's likely. I love pets!


I think thats all i can think of for now. I dunno how much actually relates too the game cause it sounds like your taking it in a differen't direction. But i think those are the general questions someones gonna ask about a mmo.
They're all good questions. This *is* a different type of MMO, believe that. Many things will be familiar, but it's not a clone game in terms of style... at all. We're going for original, and absolutely, irrevocably, cool.

[daveyoung]

Alliance Wars? Like one alliance attacks another at a sneak attack at a base or something

It's up to an alliance to create their own politics, but I am almost positive this is the kind of thing that will happen. An alliance will choose a specific game location as their home base, and need to defend it. For things like this, no extra coding is required, people create their own politics sometimes!

[Baitntackle54]

sounds great i like the idea on the character development. So when you pick beginning stats the skills that are higher level easier then the ones that aren't? So you can eventually level them all but it would take ridiculously forever because you didn't pick that stat at the beginning of the game? I like that idea. So the hardcore players have the chance to maybe try and create a character that has every skill at the highest but the casual ones can pick what skills they wan't their character too have and level those quickly? Can you say what some of the skills will be? i dont know exactly what a fangler is haha.

What happens when you die? and can you attack anyone anywhere?

[randomdude]

It's up to an alliance to create their own politics, but I am almost positive this is the kind of thing that will happen. An alliance will choose a specific game location as their home base, and need to defend it. For things like this, no extra coding is required, people create their own politics sometimes!
Awesome. Anyways just to make an alliance war more interesting how about a capture the flag mode or some sort like you have to protect this thing and if another alliance catches it then your alliance loses what make it special and have you thought about maybe a alliance choose what the thing will give them like special skills or such

[daveyoung]

Baitntackle, you have the skill concept down very well!

Can you say what some of the skills will be? i dont know exactly what a fangler is haha.
The names of these things come from the game world, and our world building team is writing them down as we try to understand what they mean. So far they all seem to have pretty obvious equivalents to things we're all familiar with.
Examples:

Fangler: a sword, or one who uses swords. To fangle someone means to really mess them up good with a sharp fangler.
A Fizzler is a player who casts spells. Sometimes those spells fizzle and don't go off! The device he uses to cast a spell (wand) is known as a fizzlestick. Fizzling is the art of casting magic, in general. And a fizzler who casts blasting spells is very good at... Fizzbanging.
A ganker is basically a rogue. His typical fighting skill would involve using a Nicker, Diddler, Diggler, which are all types of.. daggers!


I hope you get the general idea ;)

What happens when you die?
When you die, everyone cries and your enemy laughs at you. Then, you return to where you were bound to last. There will be binding locations scattered about the game world so you can always pick a bind location closest to where you want to respawn at.

Can you attack anyone anywhere?
There will be PvP safe zones where PvP isn't allowed. Otherwise, if you're a PvP character, you can attack any other PvP character.

[Baitntackle54]

Is there a punishment for dieing? loss of xp, loss of items, damage to armor though?

Other than that i am so excited for this game. If you need beta testers count me in. Great job on doing something original and not making another mmo with the same class types and such. All the people that are sick of playing mmorpgs with the same basic gameplay concept will definitely turn too your game when they hear about it.

One more question though. what will switching from a iphone to a computer be like with this game. Is it a web browser based game or will you download it? Is there anything you can't do on the iphone that you can on the computer? Will there be a difference in graphics quality?

also how will the control scheme be on the iphone? I know alot of people love how gameloft makes there control scheme. Where there is a joystick in the bottom left corner too move your character and then you can grab the screen too move the camera angle. Will we have an option like that? If you don't you should have someway too free look though. i know people love too be able too move the camera around too look at there guy from different angles.

And with those skills will there be skills unlocked within those that specialize you even more. like with fanglers once you advance in that skills does it open up into like what weapons you use and such. Fizzlers it gets more focused on either healing, enchantment, illusionary, nature, elemental type magic? And gankers maybe learn differen't skills like poison, types of combat, sneakyness

[daveyoung]

Is there a punishment for dieing? loss of xp, loss of items, damage to armor though?
Still being discussed. This is a very important thing to get right!


What will switching from a iphone to a computer be like with this game. Is it a web browser based game or will you download it? Is there anything you can't do on the iphone that you can on the computer? Will there be a difference in graphics quality?
Absolutely there will be a difference in quality. We need to design for the iPhone as the lowest common denominator, so that has a major effect on visual and gameplay design. We can do dedicated mac/pc/linux, or also do a web-based version. We're trying not to screen out any of the functionality for iPhone, though there might be some things that can't be done, I just haven't found them yet. The larger version will have more enhancements obviously, like an easier to use interface and chat system with more visible at one time :) And graphic quality is better on the computer tremendously, of course. We can use shaders on the computer, and beautiful water. The iPhone may have pretty fake looking water, while the computer version would have gorgeous water.


Also how will the control scheme be on the iphone? I know alot of people love how gameloft makes there control scheme. Where there is a joystick in the bottom left corner too move your character and then you can grab the screen too move the camera angle. Will we have an option like that? If you don't you should have someway too free look though. i know people love too be able too move the camera around too look at there guy from different angles.
We are using a tap/click to move system which makes this game possible to do at all. It is very easy to use, does not use up any screen space for move controls. We will have a free-look also, which should work as you described it.

[daveyoung]

And with those skills will there be skills unlocked within those that specialize you even more. like with fanglers once you advance in that skills does it open up into like what weapons you use and such. Fizzlers it gets more focused on either healing, enchantment, illusionary, nature, elemental type magic? And gankers maybe learn differen't skills like poison, types of combat, sneakyness

Well, for example, different weapons with high bonuses might need a certain minimum skill to wield. And that weapon/item might have special abilities tied to it. So a lot becomes possible with this kind of system. Fizzlers will have multiple 'schools' of magic to specialize in immediately. And gankers will have their own specialize skills like poison, picking locks, etc.

However, everyone will have those skills available to train too. So you could be a lockpicking fizzbanger who also fangles, for example. Just sayin'

[randomdude]

How robust will this be?

[daveyoung]

How robust will this be?

50 Robust? Hehe, which do you mean?

[Kunning]

I swear, Dave's gonna tire himself out just by answering the number of questions you guys ask. :p

[kingkong120]

I swear, Dave's gonna tire himself out just by answering the number of questions you guys ask. :p

Haha that's exactly what I was thinking. Thanks for your time and patience Dave.

[daveyoung]

I swear, Dave's gonna tire himself out just by answering the number of questions you guys ask. :p

I wouldn't worry about it. I'm working on the movement controller and testing on the device with 70 AI bots, so there is lots of little downtime between compiling, building and deploying. Perfect for answering posts. Also, I *love* this stuff.. this is the game I have dreamed of making, and is the reason I learned to code to begin with.

[Drenguin]

Man you are a talented developer, after looking at these posts I see how much you care about your games so now I'm really considering buying all of you games!

[Kunning]

Man you are a talented developer, after looking at these posts I see how much you care about your games so now I'm really considering buying all of you games!

I would recommend Arcana: Spell Duel, and CastleGuard since it's free. If you like CastleGuard, get CastleGuard2. IMO, Arcana's the best of his three games.

[daveyoung]

It's the best because it's the most recent... I've been making games for a long time but it's taken all this year to learn how to develop decently for the iPhone. So the first couple had their issues...

[Kunning]

Yeah, but still... the best game is still the best game. Don't forget to update Arcana even though I know you're swamped down with Gryphon!

[Maphia]

Dave, it's not only your impressive ambitions for this game that have me completely intrigued, it's truly your enthusiasm that's done it. Not many devs are so open to publicly answering questions, and to be honest, I've never seen anyone answer so many questions so honestly in such a short period of time before. Thank you!

And of course, to question you further:
A clarification on the "monthly plan"- this pertains only to DLC or to play in general? I know that Outer Empires (also cross-platform) is taking the pay-to-play route, and I truly think that this would substantially lower your player base. That said, I wouldn'y mind diggin through the couch for a few cents to buy a new city region; as long as not paying doesn't cripple the game.

Also, will the computer/browser versions be paid as well? Or will the iphone version just be another client for those who play the game already?

Thanks in advance, I'm sure that the only person more excited for this game than me is you!

PS- Don't scrap the "head shop"- it could bring an awesome level of customization and character individuality. (daydreaming....player-designed heads???)

[Jordanrracer]

You with ur big words dave xD

Im really suprized, havnt seen people like you talk like a adult in a while. ( im not being sarcastic) Seriously, i love you now

[daveyoung]

And of course, to question you further:
A clarification on the "monthly plan"- this pertains only to DLC or to play in general? I know that Outer Empires (also cross-platform) is taking the pay-to-play route, and I truly think that this would substantially lower your player base. That said, I wouldn'y mind diggin through the couch for a few cents to buy a new city region; as long as not paying doesn't cripple the game.

This would be different, and isn't finalized by any means. The concept we are *considering* is that, given the planned availability of DLC (run similar to Nexon/Battlefield Heroes), it might also make sense to offer a subscription program for people to get a monthly dose of ingame goodies (like ingame currency), PLUS some special members-only content.

The game will be free-to-play on the other platforms, no monthly subscription necessary. The iphone client will be a paid client for the game. You can log onto your account and play regardless of platform.

PS- Don't scrap the "head shop"- it could bring an awesome level of customization and character individuality. (daydreaming....player-designed heads???)

Not a chance of scrapping it! There may even be limited-edition heads which come out as premium content, it's a whole avalanche of player-design waiting to happen ;)

[daveyoung]

One other thing... someone did ask about the name of the game. It was going by the name 'Gryphon' as a working title, but it has been finalized as DangerLands.

If you've ever wondered what it would be like to take your Castle Legos, read the poem Jabberwocky by 💩💩💩💩💩 Carroll, have Dr Seuss write a story about it and build a setting for it, and then have a nightmare about it all and make that into an MMO... that's what DangerLands is.

[Maphia]

One other thing... someone did ask about the name of the game. It was going by the name 'Gryphon' as a working title, but it has been finalized as DangerLands.

If you've ever wondered what it would be like to take your Castle Legos, read the poem Jabberwocky by 💩💩💩💩💩 Carroll, have Dr Seuss write a story about it and build a setting for it, and then have a nightmare about it all and make that into an MMO... that's what DangerLands is.
Oh my god. I love it.

[Baitntackle54]

so if i wanted too waste all my days playing this game which i am now thinking of doing i could be a fangler/fizzler/ganker that has every skill within those skills at the highest, even the differen't schools of magic? but how much longer would that take to level then just picking a couple skills too level?

oh and another thing too ask, how does picking certain skills affect your mana/hp/defence/offence and such? is it the more skills you train that use energy/hp the more energy/hp you will have with each of those maxed skills adding on to it? or lets say i have a skill that increases energy, if i max that skill is that the max energy i can get no matter how many magic skills i have? I'm kinda assuming you do use mana or energy or something, and it works like this :P

I can't explain how excited i am for this game now dave, sounds like you put alot of time into it. And way too be answering all these questions.

[kingkong120]

I don't know if this has been answered, or if you're near this point yet, but how is the art style compared to your other games?

[Kunning]

I don't know if this has been answered, or if you're near this point yet, but how is the art style compared to your other games?

Hope it's even better than Arcana. However, the core idea of the game sounds... interesting, to word it mildly.

[daveyoung]

I made a short video for the dev team to show them what we can do for terrain following (it's important to know the limitations of slopes, etc so they can build terrains that work well) so I figured I would show you guys as well. It's my own artwork, which means lousy 'programmer art'! Thankfully I have a team with me on this one finally, so I can concentrate on what I do best.

This had 70 bots running around and runs at 15 fps iPhone 3Gs (too much vegetation!). Now they know how much is too much for trees, etc.

Just a little something early.

Lqe7PKik8Jk

and

jvCwr1sNxn8

[Kunning]

Why... is he running around waving a white flag? When he stops running though, the flag looks like a sword.

[daveyoung]

It's a weapon trail, to add a little sfx in order to gauge device capacity.

[LateralusRok]

Looks like it has a ton of potential! Depending on how you guys implement game mechanics it will either be a good game or a great game.

[Chronical]

Will it really look like a combination of Lego, Dr. Seuss and the Muppets?
I'd like to see a photoshop mashup of that!

Josh, are you jealous? ;)

[kugi_igi]

One other thing... someone did ask about the name of the game. It was going by the name 'Gryphon' as a working title, but it has been finalized as DangerLands.

If you've ever wondered what it would be like to take your Castle Legos, read the poem Jabberwocky by 💩💩💩💩💩 Carroll, have Dr Seuss write a story about it and build a setting for it, and then have a nightmare about it all and make that into an MMO... that's what DangerLands is.
hey,why not get JAbbawockeez for advertistment,hahahaha

[daveyoung]

Josh, are you jealous? ;)

I don't think a guy who's got a game with a great publisher and is near release has anything to be jealous about!

[daveyoung]

Looks like it has a ton of potential! Depending on how you guys implement game mechanics it will either be a good game or a great game.

Thanks, either good or great is acceptable hehe

[Braiton]

Looking good. Hope it runs as smooth as shown in an ITouch 2G :D

[JoshCM]

Josh, are you jealous? ;)

Jealous? Yes... maybe just a little. I'd love to have an MMO coming out soon - but we don't. Ours is planned for next year sometime.
Nice videos!
I'll be waiting for it.

[ShadowsFall]

Jealous? Yes... maybe just a little. I'd love to have an MMO coming out soon - but we don't. Ours is planned for next year sometime.
Nice videos!
I'll be waiting for it.

I'd be jealous for someone to acually make a 3D 3rd person MMORPG too :D, but I can't wait for your game to come out just as well!! Can't wait!

[ShadowsFall]

I made a short video for the dev team to show them what we can do for terrain following (it's important to know the limitations of slopes, etc so they can build terrains that work well) so I figured I would show you guys as well. It's my own artwork, which means lousy 'programmer art'! Thankfully I have a team with me on this one finally, so I can concentrate on what I do best.

This had 70 bots running around and runs at 15 fps iPhone 3Gs (too much vegetation!). Now they know how much is too much for trees, etc.

Just a little something early.

YouTube: video (http://youtube.com/watch?v=Lqe7PKik8Jk)

and

YouTube: video (http://youtube.com/watch?v=jvCwr1sNxn8)

Very very nice! Though the trees seem a bit short... And no fog effects, but not a big deal!! Just extremely early, I'm acually very pleased if you did add the "cartoon'ish" character in the video if you did add that in the game. Hovering adds less fps instead of moving legs right?

Wow!! I'm suprised at how much questions you've answered, especially my list of them... It would also be nice to have a running ability since there's no horse or anything to travel around with, you did say you liked pets earlier so that's a big +1.

What I meant by town spawn earlier was that if you died, where would you spawn back to?

[daveyoung]

Very very nice! Though the trees seem a bit short... And no fog effects, but not a big deal!! Just extremely early, I'm acually very pleased if you did add the "cartoon'ish" character in the video if you did add that in the game. Hovering adds less fps instead of moving legs right?

Those aren't production environmental assets, always the risk you run when you post a vid or pic hehe. The character style is correct in general. Low poly body with a few different mounting positions, no arms or legs/feet shaves off both bones in the animation and polies to draw. Design like this is what makes the MMO concept possible!

The character is my own creation to give the team an idea of what I wanted, but you can pretty much forget what the head looks like. We are using a different idea for that (as hinted on somewhere above)

[Kunning]

Game looks really nice... sorry I mistook the sword trail as a flag! :rolleyes:

[ShadowsFall]

Those aren't production environmental assets, always the risk you run when you post a vid or pic hehe. The character style is correct in general. Low poly body with a few different mounting positions, no arms or legs/feet shaves off both bones in the animation and polies to draw. This makes it all possible.

The character is my own creation to give the team an idea of what I wanted, but you can pretty much forget what the head looks like. We are using a different idea for that (as hinted on somewhere above)

Great!
As I meantioned earlier, maybe in mid october, I could help you out with some things you could add (not dramatic) and the controls :D, then again it'll be alright, I do enjoy helping other people out a lot.

[Kunning]

Great!
As I meantioned earlier, maybe in mid october, I could help you out with some things you could add (not dramatic) and the controls :D, then again it'll be alright, I do enjoy helping other people out a lot.

Same here! I'll help like I did with Arcana!

[Scytheron]

Awesome, I'd love to beta test this thing. I've been hoping for a REAL MMO for the iphone/ipod touch for ages, because there's nothing multiplayer about mafia wars, sorry, but I still play it for no reason. Anyways, good luck and congrats on the kiddo =D

[Goose]

I'm very impressed that you have managed to make an engine that runs the mmo connections smoothly, my question is: Does the background graphics have the potential to be high quality if the processing of other players is more basic? I know little about programming, just wondering how this might look.

[rautha harkonnen]

I'll belive it when i see some screenshots :p

[Kunning]

I'll belive it when i see some screenshots :p

Dude, check back a couple of pages. There's even a video of them testing it.

[daveyoung]

I'm very impressed that you have managed to make an engine that runs the mmo connections smoothly, my question is: Does the background graphics have the potential to be high quality if the processing of other players is more basic? I know little about programming, just wondering how this might look.

Now that we've established a baseline technology and a semi-optimized framerate with just a terrain and move controller, we carefully optimize each new feature as it goes in. It's a complex ongoing process of tricks and sound practice, balancing quality with speed. You pay attention to things like draw-distances, use Levels of Detail and billboards whenever possible, and design the play experience to avoid long open viewable spaces which would need to carry a lot of objects. There you pay attention to object density, poly counts, unique materials and material complexity, etc.

This also means making judgement calls on art and logic techniques that may suck up the CPU, and making higher-quality art assets for the non-iPhone version.

Our philosophy is to make it run nice on the iPhone first, and also add higher quality visuals for the non-iPhone platforms that are higher powered, and this has to be done with each new feature that gets added in :)

[Goose]

sounds groovy. sounds like i shall have to learn some patients!

[frankkona]

if you need programmer to work on this project. let me know. I am a IPhone developer with expertise in C++, Obj-C etc. email me directly us1915 at hotm ail dot com

[ShadowsFall]

I'll belive it when i see some screenshots :p

Fail xD

There was a video about it a few pages back, and that this developer already created several RPG games. He also answered almost every question too.

[OC Noob]

Sounds like a cool game and the vids did remind me of Asheron's Call a bit with the simple textures, yet surprisingly beautiful vistas.

I was wondering the other day if AC would work on the iPhone/iPod Touch considering it worked fine on my old pentium and S3 Virge gfx card. If I can't have some old school AC fun on the iPod atleast someone who is influenced by it is making a MMO game on this platform.

Good luck with it and thanks for sharing so much info with us.

EDIT: Just read through the posts and have a few questions.

1) Do you have to participate in PvP like Darktide in AC or will it be optional were you are flagged for it if you want to participate or are there battle ground areas where you are in PvP mode at all times? I like to do my own thing without getting ganked costently so am curious about that aspect.

2) Do you think there will be balance issues between people playing on iPhones vs people playing on the PC? I would think keyboard/mouse controls would be vastly superior, not to mention macros and hacks.

[daveyoung]

1) The PvP question is going to be a large can of worms when we open it this week to discuss.
A simple solution would be to have both all PvP and optional PvP worlds, like AC did. Some of the areas are being built specifically with PvP in mind though. I remember an awesome double tower area in the swamps near Sawato (where you could get Blunt Arrow Heads way back) which was a perfect place for two-team pvp battles!

2) That is very possible, you never know what someone will try to do. We are going to do our best on being very open-minded towards the play experience, and pay close attention to how things are being used to take advantage of others. It's sort of a new and necessary evil once you go cross-device like this.

[Grumps]

This is something we really need on the platform and no one seem to have pulled it off that well yet. Looking forward to it and grats on the baby? :rolleyes:

[pavelegorkin]

Wait for it

[daveyoung]

Last week and this weekend saw a lot of development on the DangerLands MMO project. We have our first zone terrain built, which is being called Danger Forest, sort of an Enchanted Forest.

http://www.multiplaying.net/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/Bridges-Please-1024x473.jpg

There are more screenies here (http://www.multiplaying.net/2009/10/03/zone-creation-part-1/), where the terrain designer wrote up an article about the creation of it. We did go back and forth quite a bit to find the right size and settings that would work well on the device. I was after framerates, loading times, and filesize, and Todd (terrain designer) was after something that looked nice :) The terrain quality can be scaled up or down depending on the needs of the device, so the non-iPhone version can have a nicer looking environment of course.

Framerates are still very high. I'm getting ave 40fps on the iPhone 3GS, and 30fps on the iPod touch. It's much higher in places where visibility is low, sometimes as much as another 10fps.

Now the work can begin on populating the initial zone with vegetation, trees, and other objects. There are multiple spawn locations already.

I also did a lot of work on the account and player creation code, we will be allowing multiple players per account. Lots of little things goes into this process, like unique name checking, bad word filtering, etc.

Also, as a teaser, we have our preliminary list of game skills drawn up. Still subject to change, and not all skills will be available on the initial release (mostly the combat oriented ones will be done).
Here it is:

Beasting: Use magic that has an effect on the properties, skills, and stats of creatures
Binding: Cast spells which bind magic to items, or bind people to places. Includes Sending, which is a type of travel magic.
Bolt: Use mechanical projectile weapons (Cranker, Flinger, Slinger, Bolter)
Build: Allows you to build structures of increasing complexity that can even persist in the world.
Burn: Cook food or other things which need heating up
Choosing: Lets you own and control pets
Chop: Wield hand-held heavy bladed weapons (Chopper, Dingler, Carver)
Cobble: Allows one to craft armor
Cuff: The art of hand-to-hand combat. Good ole' fisticuffs
Dazzle: Create components, potions, knicknacks. So named for the sparkly ingredients involved
Dig: Allows you to mine minerals and ore from the very ground, and dig tunnels
Dodge: Avoid damage in melee combat
Evade: Avoid getting hit by arrows and the like
Fangle: Use hand-held slashing/piercing weapons (Fangler, Slasher, Slicer, Hurter, Creaver)
Fletching: Make and Arrows or Bolts
Gank: Backstabbing, sneak attacks
Grok: Helps you figure out information about people, creatures, and items.
Hoom: Cast spells which directly affect the safety of creatures and people. Affect their vital energies, strengthen or weaken their protections. So named for the sounds these spells typically have.
Hover: Hover over the ground. The higher the skill, the higher you can hover, and for longer periods of time
Lead: Gives you greater ability to use leadership skills, and increases the value of your followers
Lore: Helps you learn how to use things, read ancient texts
Love: Lets you conquer situations with love and happiness. Includes implements of such art. Ticklers and Lovers are collectively known as Nicers, for their non-violent ways.
Nick: Use small piercing and slashing weapons (Nicker, Diddler, Diggler)
Obey: Increases your value as a follower
Pick: The art of picking locks of all types
Plink: Fire projectile weapons (Binger, Plinker, Whizzer)
Poke: Use long pointy weapons (Pokers, Stickers, Jabbers)
Sizzle: Hurl harmful magical energies at your enemies of various elemental and physical types
Smash: Use smashing weapons (Dinger, Basher, Masher, Smasher, Crasher)
Sneak: Stop other players from seeing your information, or for not being spotted
Source: Increases your mastery of Source, the energy which fuels magic. Affects recharge rate, the amount you use when you cast spells, sometimes used as a prerequisite to use an item
Tend: Allows you to tend wounds, diseases, and perform other first aid type actions
Tickle: A non-violent way to defeat creatures in combat. Includes a variety of tickling implements. Ticklers and Lovers are collectively known as Nicers, for their non-violent ways.
Tink: Create and modify weapons
Tracking: Track people, things, minerals, etc.
Void: Increases your ability to resist the affects of harmful spells cast against you
Whack: Use long, thin, smashing weapons (Banger, Whacker)
Zip: The skill which you use to travel about the world, like running!


Each of these skills is tied to one or more of your main stats and can go up with use. We're still fiddling with the list, but here it is for now:

Might: the measure of your strength
Heart: your primary vitality/health and combat energy
Cunning: the measure of your hand-eye coordination
Speed: how fast you move around and perform physical actions
Brains: the measure of your non-stupidity
Will: the amount of self-control and awareness you have


Also completed is our spell effect system, which allows the rapid creation of spells based on data files and art assets. We have a lot of cool plans for our spell system. I have done quite a lot with spells in Arcana: Spell Duel, and that work is extremely useful here! We were able to get in and finish the first fire and ice projectile spells.

That's it for now :)

[kugi_igi]

wow!!!!
this would be a big one!
i hope it will work well on my 10 yr old iPhone,LOL
hahahahha

[Goose]

thanks for keeping us updated dude, this looks fantastic.

[Baitntackle54]

You still planning for the beginning of november? I'm getting excited

[nooobynick]

Also completed is our spell effect system, which allows the rapid creation of spells based on data files and art assets. We have a lot of cool plans for our spell system. I have done quite a lot with spells in Arcana: Spell Duel, and that work is extremely useful here! We were able to get in and finish the first fire and ice projectile spells.

That's it for now :)

Is the desktop version going to see more advanced characters instead of the little block dude lol:p

[Baitntackle54]

Can we expect to see a video of actual combat soon? I'm curious as too what that will be like. And how are you going to do the macro bar? How many skills would we be able to put on it?

[Maphia]

Looking good Dave, thanks for the update. I'm loving how hard you guys try to make your game unique.
Hopefully the environment will look a little more "full" with models in it, it's a little bleak right now.

Keep up the good work!

[ShadowsFall]

Can we expect to see a video of actual combat soon? I'm curious as too what that will be like. And how are you going to do the macro bar? How many skills would we be able to put on it?

There was a video way back on some of the posts...

[ShadowsFall]

1) The PvP question is going to be a large can of worms when we open it this week to discuss.
A simple solution would be to have both all PvP and optional PvP worlds, like AC did. Some of the areas are being built specifically with PvP in mind though. I remember an awesome double tower area in the swamps near Sawato (where you could get Blunt Arrow Heads way back) which was a perfect place for two-team pvp battles!

2) That is very possible, you never know what someone will try to do. We are going to do our best on being very open-minded towards the play experience, and pay close attention to how things are being used to take advantage of others. It's sort of a new and necessary evil once you go cross-device like this.

It would be nice to have a party PVP, like 5 vs 5 =D! Different classes with a different set of skills, like healers, swordsmen, tanker (defense), magic, and archers =D

[Baitntackle54]

There was a video way back on some of the posts...

But it just had him walking around. No actual combat.

[stoattamer]

WAIT! HOLD UP!

It looks to me like that map has no way in or out. Huh? Is that the whole thing? Are you going to expand it or will you move from zone to zone like in crusade of destiny?

[Goose]

i know issa shneeky, but could we possibly see aforementioned fire/ice bolts? my curiosity, it peaks!

[daveyoung]

@nooobynick: The desktop version will have higher quality assets, and also its own interfaces. When the game loads it detects your platform and we're working the Mobile/Full logic into as much as we can.

@Baitntackle54: I'll get a video up of combat and as many other things as I can, right now I'm focusing on the character creation screens, and making sure the world building team has all the art assets they need to populate the starting zone.

@stoattamer: There are several zones in design now, we're focusing on the one for November. You will move from zone to zone. Adding the ability for players to add to the world later on and uncover their own areas, and the place could get pretty large indeed

@Goose: Yes, I will take and put up a batch of screenies at the end of this week :) Time better spent coding right now!

[Goose]

thank you! and of course, take your time

[Baitntackle54]

Sounds like things are gettin busy. I'm way excited for November.

[Baitntackle54]

Sounds like your way busy. I'm so excited for this November!

[daveyoung]

So...here's a question:
what kinds of player heads would you like to see? Animal heads (think bears, rats, foxes), zombie, armored (like ancient transformer medieval looking helmets), etc. These would be swappable heads for your player. We have a bunch in concept but I thought I'd ask for any strong opinions!

[Goose]

darth vader and yoda. and the sentinel from oldschool battlestar galactica.

[Baitntackle54]

So were gonna be able too swap our heads out like legos? Definately another first for an mmorpg :) it will be interesting too see how that turns out. Honestly doesn't sound too appealing to me but I think I trust if you guys like it, It might end up being something I do as well. Will we be able to costimize our players face or do we just pick from one of these heads? And will hoods and helmets show up?

[Baitntackle54]

You said

[ShadowsFall]

So...here's a question:
what kinds of player heads would you like to see? Animal heads (think bears, rats, foxes), zombie, armored (like ancient transformer medieval looking helmets), etc. These would be swappable heads for your player. We have a bunch in concept but I thought I'd ask for any strong opinions!

Well acually I think that there should be special capes or something :D

[Baitntackle54]

You said one of your influences for this game was asherons call. I heard that and looked it up. I looked like a great game. What might we see in this game that I'd similar to that? I like the idea of the staff taking control of a monster and attacking towns. And the way their leveling and xp worked

[daveyoung]

I liked many aspects of AC but the GM events, levelling, pvp and combat stick out most as strong influencers on the gameplay mechanics here. Very strongly in some cases, like char creation has some obvious parallels.

Speaking of which, char and account creation is finished, and you can create up to 5 players per account. Player persistence is also now working, so you return to the exact zone and location you were at when you logged out.

[daveyoung]

Well acually I think that there should be special capes or something :D


Yes, capes and shoulder/ back mounted items too, even wings perhaps...

[Baitntackle54]

This games is gonna be sweet. I'm very excited. Do we have to log out manually from the game or will we just be able to click the home button and it will be saved?

So shoulder mounted pieces and capes will actually stick out as well? Wings sound exciting.

Are you still planning on the beginning of November to release?

When might we see some videos or screen shots of the creation screen and combat?

Haha sorry if that's too many questions keep up the good work! Sound like you got alot done fairly quickly.

[ShadowsFall]

Yes, capes and shoulder/ back mounted items too, even wings perhaps...

please add wings!!! freaken amazing to have angel wings and stuff like that :D

Oh yeah, some questions...

Will players be able to sell things to other players? Like rare items and such?

Is there a ability to acually add a gem or something into a weapon/armor and make it more powerful?

And that's just about it lol.

[daveyoung]

Yes, players will be able to trade with other players, and buy from stores. We haven't even gotten into crafting yet but item enhancement is something we are highly interested in down the road. I have a love/hate relationship with inventories and item systems, so there will be a lot of attention given to this.

[daveyoung]

Do we have to log out manually from the game or will we just be able to click the home button and it will be saved?

Are you still planning on the beginning of November to release?

When might we see some videos or screen shots of the creation screen and combat?

You are save automatically, as things happen. This is actually a careful balance of timing. Too often and you create a laggy and unstable situation, too seldom and you potentially miss saving important game events. It's a persistent world, just like an MMO should be.

We are still planning on submitting at the beginning of November.

We are going to try and get some screenies up this weekend!

[han0007]

Hey what does MMO stand for. I've benn trying to figure it out. Thanks

[Goose]

mass multiplayer online.

[han0007]

mass multiplayer online.

Thanks.

[Goose]

so Dave, any more news about your heads? are they going to serve as graphical customization, or are they going to have stats themselves?

[daveyoung]

so Dave, any more news about your heads? are they going to serve as graphical customization, or are they going to have stats themselves?

I don't know how you thought of that top secret information ;), but both are true. Primary is customization and some are ability enhancing/rares.

[daveyoung]

Here are some shots I took on my iPhone of the working Character Creation flow. It builds your character, saves it, and lets you login to the world with him. Missing still is the appearance customization as we're still waiting on art.

The bottom shots show a work in progress environment, made in low quality for this particular device.

Step 1: Login.
http://daveyounggames.com/wp-content/gallery/dangerlandscharcreate1/step1.jpg

Step 2: Retrieves char list from the database. We already have a character, but want to create a new one :)
http://daveyounggames.com/wp-content/gallery/dangerlandscharcreate1/step1a.jpg

Step 3: Choose a Gender (and race too, when we have some)
http://daveyounggames.com/wp-content/gallery/dangerlandscharcreate1/step2.jpg

Step 4: Choose a template, or a custom one. Each starts with a preset of stats and skills, or the Adventurer template is completely custom (you choose everything)
http://daveyounggames.com/wp-content/gallery/dangerlandscharcreate1/step3.jpg

Step 5: Allot your stat points. You can mix and match your stat points, but you only have a certain number to play with.
http://daveyounggames.com/wp-content/gallery/dangerlandscharcreate1/step4.jpg

Step 6: Skills. Train some skills, choose to focus in others. View the skill descriptions and formulas here as well.
http://daveyounggames.com/wp-content/gallery/dangerlandscharcreate1/step5.jpg

Step 7: Choose a name. Name is validated against a bad word list and previously taken names.
http://daveyounggames.com/wp-content/gallery/dangerlandscharcreate1/step6.jpg

Step 8: Character has been created! Choose him from the list, and Load.
http://daveyounggames.com/wp-content/gallery/dangerlandscharcreate1/step7.jpg

Step 9: Logs into the game world at a starting location. His location is saved everytime he completes a move. When you login again, you will be put back at the exact spot you were at when you logged off/crashed.
http://daveyounggames.com/wp-content/gallery/dangerlandscharcreate1/ingame1.jpg

http://daveyounggames.com/wp-content/gallery/dangerlandscharcreate1/ingame2.jpg

http://daveyounggames.com/wp-content/gallery/dangerlandscharcreate1/ingame3.jpg

http://daveyounggames.com/wp-content/gallery/dangerlandscharcreate1/ingame4.jpg

So that's it! This is working cross platform so far, though the non i-Phone versions have better visuals. If you see a little yellow number in the shots, it's frames per second, which is an indication of how fast the game is running. It's an important metric for us to use when deciding what details we can get away with. Anything over 17 is great, 25+ and you're watching at the same rat you see when you watch a movie.

[Goose]

i guess it's not so hard to glean the info from here ;)

I guess you need a dragon head then, a panda head and for good measure, a chuck norris head.

[Baitntackle54]

Wow first off the environment looks pretty impressive so far, Now that I can see some buildings and structures instead of endless Forrest :) and ofcourse I got some questions that have popped to mind.

Is that what our final characters will kinda look like or is that just a quick graphic to have a character their cause the real ones aren't done? It seems kinda out of place to the surroundings.

So the initial stat thing decides how quick you level the skills in those stats? Even though you can still level them all too the highest?

Do you have a macro bar planned where we can add and take off spells? Or is their another mechanism to using all the spells we want too? Cause those 2 circles don't look like a ton of variety for so many different things to choose from :)

[daveyoung]

That's my programmer artwork. Sorry, necessary evil while I wait on art :)

Yes, a macro bar is planned, those buttons are in there for quick tests of various actions I am developing. The bow button links iceballs actually, and random amounts of aggro sometimes... handy tests ;) There are far too many options to squeeze onto 2 buttons, so I've had to come up with something clever.

Each stat takes exp to raise. So if you start a stat higher, it is going to be easier to raise it higher. So you would pick those based on the skills you're going after, or the build of your character.

[Baitntackle54]

Haha so when will the character art be done so we can see some? Will we hopefully see it this weekend along with the combat?

[Aegis]

anxiously awaiting beta.

[Baitntackle54]

I was just watching that YouTube video you gave us a few weeks ago. Are the characters and npcs really gonna move that quick? That seems really fast, I mean if you gave us a speed skill or a skill that had buffs and one of them was speed I could see us maybe moving quick like that. But just for a normal charcter that's like faster then a full out sprint :) our characters would be absolutely exausted haha

[daveyoung]

Are the characters and npcs really gonna move that quick?

Nope! They have a speed stat and a Zip skill. Zip skill dictates how fast they move in the world. It is tied to the speed stat, can be buffed, and can be raised independently. The speed of that char was for my world building team, so they could run around and see their map in scale.

The speed stat also has an affect on how fast you animate, swing your weapon, etc.

[1magus]

Ok I tried to PM you but I guess I will try it this way lol, do you need extra help on this project? I can make 3D models through 3Ds Max 2010!
Contact: Duelist_99@hotmail.com

[Baitntackle54]

You still doing the new screenshots and videos this weekend?

[JoshCM]

Dave can I ask if you guys are using Unity for this?
Or is it something proprietary?

[ShadowsFall]

anxiously awaiting beta.

arn't we all xP..

A few questions again :D, need screenshotz too please xD

Will there be a member limit in your clan? If so, then how many? And with friends list also?

Is there going to be a PvP arena or a 1 vs 1 arena? Let me explain this one... Do you get to spawn in a special room for pvp, or do you go out into the wild and kill or be killed?

Is there going to be a teleportation scroll so you can teleport back to a town if in danger or too far from the town?

Is there going to be clan battles, or places specificly for clan battles?

Is there a trading system so far?

How many towns are there going to be in the game?

If it is possible, is there going to be skills you can have such as cutting trees, crafting, etc?

Is there going to be a social area? For example a bar and such?

Is there going to be many quests?

Any level cap?

Is there going to be dragons and such?

How many monsters and npc's are there going to be all together?

Is there going to be special/funny clothing avalable for holidays and such?

How many different landscapes are there? For example beaches, snowy mountain, deserts, snowy trees, etc? If there is more than just grass, then tell us all the landscapes.

Is there going to be skill books?

An ability to fish and sell?

Is there going to be any stalls you can set up to sell items while you're away from the computer?

Any beautiful fountains and such to make up the landscape?

And thats about it for now xP...

[daveyoung]

Dave can I ask if you guys are using Unity for this?
Or is it something proprietary?

Josh, we're using ShiVa. I was a Torque guy for years and years, but once I switched to ShiVa I started actually making games instead of tech for games.

It's top notch and the dev team is very active. I've heard outstanding things about Unity as well of course!

[daveyoung]

You still doing the new screenshots and videos this weekend?

I'm coding, but judging by the progress I've seen on the environment, the object placement is getting down to bushes and rocks and lighting, so chances of that are good :)

[Baitntackle54]

The combat system done? Like all the different skills and spell effects and such?

[xdanleex]

how much this? 10 dollar... cuz ill buy for that price when i get the money :)

[daveyoung]

The combat system done? Like all the different skills and spell effects and such?

Nope! There's a good dent in it, but with 39 skills, it's hard to finish them all at once....

Like I've said though, this release's focus is on PvP, so we will make sure all those skills are done and ready :)

[Baitntackle54]

Are you aiming for the begining of november? or sometime in between?

[Winin]

Hey everyone,

I'm the guy who's been building the world. I'm glad you like what you've seen so far. I just finished placing and tweaking the trees and mushrooms. Buildings are already done, so next up I'm doing the ferns, rocks, and other small bits. Then comes lighting. But already it is shaping up into a nicely creepy forest.

I contribute to a gaming blog, and I've been posting updates over there. Here are the DangerLands articles:
http://www.multiplaying.net/tag/dangerlands/

I wrote some about the behind-the-scenes stuff that goes into zone creation, so I hope you find them interesting. If not, you can just look at the pretty pictures. :P We also do a podcast, so expect some chat from me in future episodes, and if we can talk Dave into it, we'll interview him.

Let me see if I can whip up a nice pic of Shroom Corner to attach. You should feel special, I just finished it and Dave hasn't even seen it yet.

Enjoy
--Winin

[Haephestos]

That looks very nice, but the squared off 'walls' are something to avoid. I know from experiance (I make crysis levels) that it makes it way less immersive, and can be disconcerting for the player. I'm not exactly sure how terrain editing is done in ShiVa though.

[1magus]

I played EverQuest 2 for a few years and instead of simple boxed off walls something like a mountain or a Ocean or even a Lake can be used to make the player forget about the boundaries of the current map they are in.

[Baitntackle54]

Could you explain what some of the different schools of magic are? I'm really curious about that. And when you said different schools of magic did you just mean different skills? Or when you train source and sizzle do you pick from within that?

[ShadowsFall]

Hey everyone,

I'm the guy who's been building the world. I'm glad you like what you've seen so far. I just finished placing and tweaking the trees and mushrooms. Buildings are already done, so next up I'm doing the ferns, rocks, and other small bits. Then comes lighting. But already it is shaping up into a nicely creepy forest.

I contribute to a gaming blog, and I've been posting updates over there. Here are the DangerLands articles:
http://www.multiplaying.net/tag/dangerlands/

I wrote some about the behind-the-scenes stuff that goes into zone creation, so I hope you find them interesting. If not, you can just look at the pretty pictures. :P We also do a podcast, so expect some chat from me in future episodes, and if we can talk Dave into it, we'll interview him.

Let me see if I can whip up a nice pic of Shroom Corner to attach. You should feel special, I just finished it and Dave hasn't even seen it yet.

Enjoy
--Winin

Great! Now I can get the up-to-date info on how things are going :D

[daveyoung]

That looks very nice, but the squared off 'walls' are something to avoid. I know from experiance (I make crysis levels) that it makes it way less immersive, and can be disconcerting for the player. I'm not exactly sure how terrain editing is done in ShiVa though.

Aesthetically you are definitely correct - who doesn't like wide open rolling terrains? The terrain is an occluding object however, which is definitely needed for the iPhone.

[Winin]

Thanks for the suggestions and feedback! I tried smoother, more natural looking terrain at first, but when I viewed it on the small screen, I didn't notice many of the details, so I tried this blockier/cartoonier terrain. We liked the look, and it fit with the overall art style we were going for. Screenshots don't do it justice. While running around in the world, it works for me. Hopefully others will like it too.

As for the zone walls, well, I did want a bit of a claustrophobic feel to make the forest creepier. I have been messing around with different skyboxes to see how they work (dark clouds, the underside of a tree canopy, etc.). I'll try a mountain skyline and see if that gives the illusion of something other than a run-of-the-mill zone wall.

Unfortunately, we are constrained to use fairly small maps, so I try to squeeze as much content and playable area into each map as I can. And if any point on the map is drastically higher than other points, you'll be able to look down and see everything (i.e. nothing will be occluded) and your iPhone will explode from the strain. :eek: For the same reason, I tried to avoid having long "corridors" where you can see from one end of the map to the other. It a lot of ways, it was like setting up a board for a tabletop miniatures game.

[Haephestos]

Aesthetically you are definitely correct - who doesn't like wide open rolling terrains? The terrain is an occluding object however, which is definitely needed for the iPhone.
This is an important thing in any game for performance. Does ShiVa support LOD settings for models, and occluder areas?

Unfortunately, we are constrained to use fairly small maps, so I try to squeeze as much content and playable area into each map as I can. And if any point on the map is drastically higher than other points, you'll be able to look down and see everything (i.e. nothing will be occluded) and your iPhone will explode from the strain. :eek:
I had this issue with one of my crysis levels, so I totally understand what you are saying. A player had to fight their way up the inside of a mountain and get on top for extraction, but the performance was really nasty even with LODs enabled on anything but a pretty decent gaming computer. So what I did was use two layers of non-volumetric clouds with occluder areas placed in between the layers. Unfortunately the map never got finished.

Just something to think about. :)

[Baitntackle54]

we gonna have any npcs running around in danger Forrest with us on this first release? You should have like one big powerful one that wanders the forest and everyone is trying too keep away from. That would add to the feeling you want :)

[plucksch]

This looks terrific, please do carry on and complete this idea.
What do you think, will there be a monthly charge for the servers?

Best luck!

[BatOutofEarth]

Your modesty is overwhelming!

[daveyoung]

This is an important thing in any game for performance. Does ShiVa support LOD settings for models, and occluder areas?


Yes, there are several types of collusion for the non-iPhone platform. The iPhone platform does not have the best type of occlusion: hardware based occlusion, so we are making heavy use of the terrain occlusion, which does work. The other question about LODs... ShiVa can support mesh LOD in its Unlimited version which we don't have yet (too costly for me ATM), so we'll be using our own LOD system to eliminate the rendering bottlenecks we can, by using BBs and activation distance in code.

The engine does a lot, but as we're making the iPhone client a priority, we need to pull out all the tricks and some of them fall on the design level.

[daveyoung]

This looks terrific, please do carry on and complete this idea.
What do you think, will there be a monthly charge for the servers?

Best luck!

I am pretty sure we won't be requiring a monthly charge, but rather going the 'free-to-play' route (with the exception of the iPhone client up front cost). We have been tossing around the idea of a possible monthly subscription option with additional benefits.

[daveyoung]

we gonna have any npcs running around in danger Forrest with us on this first release? You should have like one big powerful one that wanders the forest and everyone is trying too keep away from. That would add to the feeling you want :)

There won't be NPCs in the first release, it doesn't fall into the schedule. They will be in the second release, along with native creatures. The first release is focused around PvP and exploration, and all the necessary features to support it.

The world server technology is fairly well designed at this point however, if not yet implemented. So I am quite confident the second monthly release will see that happening.

[daveyoung]

Could you explain what some of the different schools of magic are? I'm really curious about that. And when you said different schools of magic did you just mean different skills? Or when you train source and sizzle do you pick from within that?

The schools of magic are:
Creeping: Use magic that has an effect on the properties, skills, and stats of creatures
Hoom: Cast spells which directly affect the safety of creatures and people. Affect their vital energies, strengthen or weaken their protections. So named for the sounds these spells typically have
Sizzle: Hurl harmful magical energies at your enemies of various elemental and physical types
Binding: Cast spells which bind magic to items, or bind people to places. Includes Sending, which is a type of travel magic

Each of these has their own spells. Once a player has trained/focused the basic skill, he can increase in mastery of it over time and therefore be able to cast more and more powerful spells in it.

A 'fizzle' is what happens when you fail to cast a spell ;)

The other spell-related skill is:
Source: Increases your mastery of Source, the energy which fuels magic. Affects recharge rate, the amount you use when you cast spells, sometimes used as a prerequisite to use an item

[1magus]

You claimed you want to focus the first release on PVP and Exploration but exploring a world without NPCs is a tad weird, will there at least be computer controlled enemies out there to defeat lol?

[daveyoung]

You claimed you want to focus the first release on PVP and Exploration but exploring a world without NPCs is a tad weird, will there at least be computer controlled enemies out there to defeat lol?

Adding in enemies in an MMO is not a trivial task. There may be NPCs, but almost definitely not computer-controlled enemies until the second dev cycle.

[Tarcin]

Could I be a beta/alpha tester? Also I can help you construct the world if you want. Pm me and I can start helping you, though I need a map of the place (if you have one) and some other info. but pm me.

[ShadowsFall]

Adding in enemies in an MMO is not a trivial task. There may be NPCs, but almost definitely not computer-controlled enemies until the second dev cycle.

Alright, so is there a level cap, and are there any skills like strength, mana, etc. to boost up?

[daveyoung]

Alright, so is there a level cap, and are there any skills like strength, mana, etc. to boost up?

There is a planned level cap of around lvl 100, and every stat and trained/focused skill can be boosted at any time throughout your career with experience that you've earned. Most skills also go up with use.

[Aegis]

without NPCs how will low population times be addressed, say I log on at 4am (i dont sleep well) and theres nobody on? do i just twiddle my thumbs?

[daveyoung]

without NPCs how will low population times be addressed, say I log on at 4am (i dont sleep well) and theres nobody on? do i just twiddle my thumbs?

No, I will make sure there's something for you to do ;)

I *am* experimenting with some NPCs on a simplistic level and because most of the game data comes from a server, it will *not* be difficult for us to put in NPCs at least. It's the monsters and AI there that may take until the second update. That being said, we do want to get them in as soon as possible.

[daveyoung]

I was finishing up the basics for the persistent player inventory.
It's set up now with 144 possible inventory slots, and can do drag-and-drop, equip, unequip, close.

It's pretty sweet because it pulls your inventory down from the database, shows it for you in a paged slot format, and lets you click on an item to view some information about it. Inventories are an insane amount of work. Still lots to do on it, and add support for the other item types (just did weapons so I can get to combat).

Anyway, I shot a quick vid to show the team, I'll share with you guys too.

I-oMxNVOVHE

[Goose]

cool man, looks like it's coming along really well.

[daveyoung]

cool man, looks like it's coming along really well.

Thanks, it *is* moving along well. With each piece I code I'm getting closer and closer to a cross platform MMO framework that you can play from anywhere with an Internet connection. That is very exciting to me :) Systems like inventory can be rather painful to implement, so each little step forward is a big deal.

At some point in time it's going to be moving into just working on art and content, which will be a blast.

[Goose]

At some point in time it's going to be moving into just working on art and content, which will be a blast.

I anxiously look forward to seeing how this turns out.

[p0rtalthinker101]

Yes, it has begun, if unofficially. If you are familiar with any of my previous games, you could maybe put together that I've been developing RPG elements all year... combat, weapons, quests, NPCs, spells, special effects, networking code, etc.

So I actually have quite a bit prototyped already. The initial release will contain a core amount of gameplay (focused around online PvP probably), and we're using a short development cycle for each subsequent release. My previous experience with Indie dev teams is that sometimes life gets in the way, so it's best to keep it going in short bursts.

Our first development cycle starts October 1st, and will be focused on the set of features that can be finished for a November release. In the meantime, we're designing and planning while the world team is peeping into the alternate universe. I've got a clean codebase up and running, and realtime multiplayer engine is up and running.

I *will* put up a screenie/vid soon.. it will be a hoot to watch a game being built from square one to a finished product, like I did right here for Arcana. Fun for us anyway :)
Did you say you can only play when connected to wifi on the ipod touch? :( And yes, if you need any experienced beta testers, im all in for helping you out :)

[squarezero]

Thanks, it *is* moving along well. With each piece I code I'm getting closer and closer to a cross platform MMO framework that you can play from anywhere with an Internet connection. That is very exciting to me :) Systems like inventory can be rather painful to implement, so each little step forward is a big deal.

At some point in time it's going to be moving into just working on art and content, which will be a blast.
Just went through the whole thread to catch up with how this project is shaping up. I have to say, Dave, I'm impressed: you guys have come a long way since CastleGuard2. One small aesthetic note on the menus: the use of that particular typeface on a black background makes them look like Woody Allen film titles (see below) -- not exactly the kind of feel you want for a fantasy game. It may seem like a minor thing, but atmosphere is a big part of what makes a fantasy game come alive, and it seems like it would be a comparatively minor task to take the menus in a different direction.

Feel free to PM is you want to talk further about this...

http://kitblog.com/images/annie-hall.png

[daveyoung]

One small aesthetic note on the menus: the use of that particular typeface on a black background makes them look like Woody Allen film titles (see below) -- not exactly the kind of feel you want for a fantasy game.

I'm not considering any of the visuals to be final at all, choosing a typeface or particular style for the GUIs is something we haven't gotten to yet, hence the all-black. I'm just not a designer unfortunately. It will be fun to do that part and go through and replace things. I'll be *sure* to post some pics up to get opinions at that point.

Thanks for the kind words! I'm still going solo on the coding and database stuff, but have plenty of help on the game design and worldbuilding side. It's making a big difference.

[squarezero]

I'm not considering any of the visuals to be final at all, choosing a typeface or particular style for the GUIs is something we haven't gotten to yet, hence the all-black. I'm just not a designer unfortunately. It will be fun to do that part and go through and replace things. I'll be *sure* to post some pics up to get opinions at that point.

Thanks for the kind words! I'm still going solo on the coding and database stuff, but have plenty of help on the game design and worldbuilding side. It's making a big difference.
I'll definitely be picking it up, regardless of how the menus look... but I'm glad to hear that you're still working on them.

[Winin]

Now I want to play a Woody Allen mmo.

[Baitntackle54]

Yeah you have come a long way, I am so excited for this game to come out you have no idea. Well maybe you do :) but I have never looked so forward to one game.

[1magus]

Are you using Unity at all to make this game?

[daveyoung]

Are you using Unity at all to make this game?

Nope

[blk04a4]

i just wanted to say this game looks awesome, but more the fact that you keep everyone involved. I followed your thread when you were creating Arcana: Spell Duel, and its just really cool how you post your progression and let everyone else know how its going. I am a huge fan keep up the good work! i cant wait until this comes out!

[daveyoung]

i just wanted to say this game looks awesome, but more the fact that you keep everyone involved. I followed your thread when you were creating Arcana: Spell Duel, and its just really cool how you post your progression and let everyone else know how its going. I am a huge fan keep up the good work! i cant wait until this comes out!

Thanks for the support! To everyone who's been asking about testing, we will be running some closed testing of the existing systems soon in an online test, probably using the web version. It will be a very early look at the game in it's early stages, a scary time but a fun one too.

Most teams wouldn't do something like this because lots of pieces will be missing. So you run the risk of having some people not realizing it's not a finished project. However, I've had the honor of being able to beta test most MMOs, even the originals, and I would have loved to have seen it from the moment you could run around in even an empty map. So we are going to be giving you guys that opportunity as well. Bugs and all.

This will happen just as soon as we feel the minimal pieces are in place, it's going online. No need to PM and ask :)

[Baitntackle54]

Cannot wait to test it for ya. Count me in :)

[Baitntackle54]

Are you open to adding alot more skills as players recommen them cause I'm sure there will be plenty of people who will? Or are you pretty much set on what you have and what you want to add? Haha cause I already have an idea for a few more.

[Sixxes]

Cant wait for the beta. Hope I can test :D

[MasonStorm]

I can't wait!!! I'd love to get in on testing

[1magus]

If it's one thing I liked from eq2 it was the housing system, sure it did not affect combat in any way but it did hold a grand achievement of you're completed quests and adventure thru the items you obtained over the months of playing. Do you plan to do some sort of house system?

[daveyoung]

Are you open to adding alot more skills as players recommen them cause I'm sure there will be plenty of people who will? Or are you pretty much set on what you have and what you want to add? Haha cause I already have an idea for a few more.

We will definitely be growing the game as time marches on, carefully considering new additions for gameplay blance and fairness.

[Aegis]

anything new to show us today?

[daveyoung]

anything new to show us today?

Not yet. The initial game environment has been completed, I'm still working on tightening up all the functionality that was prototyped.

Doing things like making sure initial equipment is given out to players when their player is first created, making sure the proper skills states are being recorded, etc. I'm pretty sure we're going to be putting up something this weekend for testing.

I've also got a decent prototype at the server technology needed to control AI monsters ingame. I got a little sidetracked with it, but it's the technology we will use to help run ingame events. We will be able to take manual control over an entire area and do things like, spawn new critters, take control of a critter and let the player have a *real* challenge :)

[Baitntackle54]

Will we just test it on the dangerlands website throught the browser version?

[acidshaman]

so is this a present day or wat?

i dont really like present day because imo guns should be like 1-2 shots... i hate how guns are nerfed so hard in many games...

[daveyoung]

Will we just test it on the dangerlands website throught the browser version?

Yes, or the mac or the pc standalone version

[daveyoung]

so is this a present day or wat?

i dont really like present day because imo guns should be like 1-2 shots... i hate how guns are nerfed so hard in many games...

It's starting out as medieval/fantasy. However, the long term goal is to introduce time travelling elements in and other time periods. The strange portals which brought people to the world also can warp time.

[Baitntackle54]

Wait so their is a web browser version that everyone can access and then there is a pc standalone and mac standalone version? What would be the difference between the web browser and standalone version?

[daveyoung]

Wait so their is a web browser version that everyone can access and then there is a pc standalone and mac standalone version? What would be the difference between the web browser and standalone version?

Fundamentally, a standalone will run faster but requires an installation. A web version would be 'more accessible', but runs as a browser plugin.

[Baitntackle54]

Ok makes sense, so there won't be much of a difference between the two then just having to download the standalone version and it will run a little easier? So do you have something ready to release this weekend?

[Winin]

I spoke about the game a bit on the latest Multiplaying podcast. Dave will have to speak to the release schedule.

http://www.multiplaying.net/2009/10/25/multiplaying-012-10-23-09/

--Todd

[Aegis]

update us dave? (shameless bump, im anxiously awaiting to hear more)

[Baitntackle54]

He's working so hard he has forgot to check this :) I best he has something good in store for us.

[daveyoung]

I do have something *awesome* in store. But I couldn't get it wrapped up in time for a test this weekend. I will post more tomorrow.

[daveyoung]

I completely cursed myself by publicly saying I want to have something out by the end of the weekend!

[plucksch]

haha, stay cool we will wait!

[JoshCM]

so what is the schedule for this Dave? I heard you mention something about early November submission - does that hold true or are you doing some new things with it - oh and when can I beta test it? :)

[daveyoung]

That was overly optimistic, I had an awesome start and then got bogged down with work and my second job :( However! the ToDo list is getting smaller and smaller every day. I'm sure you remember those days :)

I'm putting some character appearance options in now. I wanted to get rudimentary combat better tweaked (and networked) in time for the test, so that's the last piece before we open it up for early testing.

In the meantime, the initial zone is complete for exploration, and work is being done on some GUIs and fonts.

[Braiton]

Looking good. Looking forward to this.

[Sixxes]

Yeah, I can't wait too.

[Brazilian Rider]

Remember that I'm here to beta test for you!

[Kunning]

Remember that I'm here to beta test for you!

Same here! 我也是！A mi tambien!

[ShadowsFall]

That was overly optimistic, I had an awesome start and then got bogged down with work and my second job :( However! the ToDo list is getting smaller and smaller every day. I'm sure you remember those days :)

I'm putting some character appearance options in now. I wanted to get rudimentary combat better tweaked (and networked) in time for the test, so that's the last piece before we open it up for early testing.

In the meantime, the initial zone is complete for exploration, and work is being done on some GUIs and fonts.

Lol, atleast you get paid xD! I don't even have a job yet >.>.. Well acually i can probably get one -_-, and i can almost drive in about several months so yeah.

[daveyoung]

Whew! What a week! Just a quick note to say that I'm pretty sure well be running the multiplayer test later this weekend. Its main purpose is to give an early look at things and for us to see what kinds of problems come up with the networking.

There won't be much to do except run around, chat, and perhaps some other surprises. I'm giving us the day tomorrow to get things ready and I'll post up a download link when it's ready. If all goes well, that will be tomorrow night.

If you will be around and would like to help test the multiplayer in its primitive state (ie make a char and run around), post here with your platform (mac or pc), your video card, and if you have a microphone to use ingame.

[ShadowsFall]

Whew! What a week! Just a quick note to say that I'm pretty sure well be running the multiplayer test later this weekend. Its main purpose is to give an early look at things and for us to see what kinds of problems come up with the networking.

There won't be much to do except run around, chat, and perhaps some other surprises. I'm giving us the day tomorrow to get things ready and I'll post up a download link when it's ready. If all goes well, that will be tomorrow night.

If you will be around and would like to help test the multiplayer in its primitive state (ie make a char and run around), post here with your platform (mac or pc), your video card, and if you have a microphone to use ingame.

What about the iphone/ipod?

[daveyoung]

What about the iphone/ipod?

It's logically next, if this test goes well

[TouchChatterbox]

Sounds fantastic. Thanks for not making yet another TD or Match 3 game :P

PC
NVidia 8800GT
Mic - Yes

[Baitntackle54]

I'll test it. I have one of those aluminum MacBooks. So it has a nvidia graphics card. Not sure which one. And it has a mic built in,

[ShadowsFall]

I'll test it. I have one of those aluminum MacBooks. So it has a nvidia graphics card. Not sure which one. And it has a mic built in,

Lol waistful mutch? I'm pretty shure if you want a good gaming computer, you might as well make your own, but if not, then okay, just make the computer worth while

[Tarcin]

I'll test it!


I have a Nvidia Card.. I don't know how to get which type though.
Mic: No

[Baitntackle54]

Lol waistful mutch? I'm pretty shure if you want a good gaming computer, you might as well make your own, but if not, then okay, just make the computer worth while

What's wrong with a MacBook lol? Been ableto play ever game i tried on it easily? Haha and I'm only 15 so I'm not exctly gonna be able to buil my own computer. And I can't stand windows software.

[ShadowsFall]

What's wrong with a MacBook lol? Been ableto play ever game i tried on it easily? Haha and I'm only 15 so I'm not exctly gonna be able to buil my own computer. And I can't stand windows software.

lol my friends 15, you can save a lot more money if you learn how to build your own, you can even have enough to buy a 40" TV

[Balu`]

I'd be happy to test it!
I have a PC with a Nvidia 8800GT, but I haven't a (working) microphone.

[Baitntackle54]

lol my friends 15, you can save a lot more money if you learn how to build your own, you can even have enough to buy a 40" TV

Yes but then you have to buy all that software that normal computers come with and that can add up. Expecially if it's windows, my friend got his own custome built computer and he hates it, my little 5 pound MacBook can run better that that and he wasted 4 grand buildin it and getting the best possible software. Aluminum MacBooks will last over 5 years before you even have to change the battery. They are built so solid that they don't really get the problems you will find from other computers because they are built out of a block f aluminum. They are more universal than windows because you can run anything windows on them. They last 7 hours on a singlecharge. Mac os x leapord is like the most advanced operating system you can find, and it uses your computer the most efficient way possible getting maximum speed and performance. Plus no malware or freezing or crashes. You can attach it to a display if you reallyfeel the need for a 40 inch screen but I would pik portability over a big cinema display cause you don't really need it. But let's not get in a huge mac verse pc battle because no one ever knows what they are talking about when they criticise mac owners and it seems really pointless to criticises something you don't know about it. I have tried all sorts of computers and the MacBook is the best I have ever had. I know plenty of people with custom computers and they seem to have a couple year lifespan at most and just get slower and slower.

[ShadowsFall]

Yes but then you have to buy all that software that normal computers come with and that can add up. Expecially if it's windows, my friend got his own custome built computer and he hates it, my little 5 pound MacBook can run better that that and he wasted 4 grand buildin it and getting the best possible software. Aluminum MacBooks will last over 5 years before you even have to change the battery. They are built so solid that they don't really get the problems you will find from other computers because they are built out of a block f aluminum. They are more universal than windows because you can run anything windows on them. They last 7 hours on a singlecharge. Mac os x leapord is like the most advanced operating system you can find, and it uses your computer the most efficient way possible getting maximum speed and performance. Plus no malware or freezing or crashes. You can attach it to a display if you reallyfeel the need for a 40 inch screen but I would pik portability over a big cinema display cause you don't really need it. But let's not get in a huge mac verse pc battle because no one ever knows what they are talking about when they criticise mac owners and it seems really pointless to criticises something you don't know about it. I have tried all sorts of computers and the MacBook is the best I have ever had. I know plenty of people with custom computers and they seem to have a couple year lifespan at most and just get slower and slower.

Lol, well use linux or windows 7 professional. Shure it may be not as great, but you don't need that much software for a computer. You can just spend about 800 bucks on a 2k computer if you build your own. And it doesn't get that slow, just like if you build a mac computer, it's the same thing. It gets slow at times. crashes are easy to fix if you know how to do it, and mac does have several problems. The more affordable, more better. Unless you have the money to buy a mac. Not all macs are built for gaming, some are just for entertainment and such. So you won't get the same preformance if you build your own.

[daveyoung]

Not going to happen tonight, I'm having connection issues. Going to take a break and go see Vampires Assistant.

[Sixxes]

I wanna test :D

I have Windows XP and an Nvidia (Some kind of it, anyways.)
And yes, I will most likely be able to use a mic.

[Kerrby]

So do we have any images for this?

[Braiton]

I can test too whenever its up. Im using Windows XP and a Nvidia GeForce FX 5200 card. And of course, i've been having loads of free time lately. I might have a mic lying somewhere.

[ShadowsFall]

Not going to happen tonight, I'm having connection issues. Going to take a break and go see Vampires Assistant.

Haven't seen the movie yet lol, oh yes.. Everyone needs a break from their epic gamemaking skills

[Baitntackle54]

Haha Dave I'm having a little problem with the forums on www.dangerlands.com i signed up for them ad baitntackle54 and gave it my email but I never got the confirmation so I tried it again and it tells me the name is taken.

[Brazilian Rider]

Platform:Windows XP
Graphics Card:Nvidia Card (honestly, I don't know which one. I know it's hella old since I have a 2001 computer -perfect if you want to test old games!)
Microphone: If the game allows me to use my 2-in-1 camera/microphone as a mic, I'll have one.

[ChocoVanilla]

Lol...dunno if I'm too late or on time...but here:

OS: Windows 7 Ultimate
Graphics Card: ...lol...really don't know
Mic: Yes, can do

[kie]

Hi daveyoung,

I have an HP laptop with Windows XP Home Premium, an NVIDIA GeForce Go 7400 graphics card and a built in mic.

Cheers,
kie

[daveyoung]

Haha Dave I'm having a little problem with the forums on www.dangerlands.com i signed up for them ad baitntackle54 and gave it my email but I never got the confirmation so I tried it again and it tells me the name is taken.

We hadn't even announced the forums yet, they're still being worked on. User registration should work, though, so my guess would be to try having the password sent to you, there's usually some 'forgot my password' link.

For others, we have set up forums.. I thought they would come in handy while testing! Please register on the forums and post any test-related stuff over there. I'll still post news and whatnot and answer questions over here, but it will be better for us to keep all the tests in our own area.

http://www.dangerlands.com

And.. speaking of testing..
We had a somewhat successful multiplayer test tonight, so I'm going to go ahead and put up the mac and pc builds for people to grab. I say somewhat, because you can always create an account, login with the account, and create a character, but the connection to the server is flaky, failing quite often when trying to login with a player. It either is going to connect right away, or you will need to restart the game and try again. Sometimes it has no problem at all, and sometimes it takes 5 or 6 tries before you can log a player in.

This is the fun of very early technology :)

There is a chat box online, and the Bow button is hooked to the Ice Ball spell.
So, if you feel like seeing a developer prototype of our game, feel free to grab it and experience the pain and fun of early access!

Link to the download in about an hour.

[daveyoung]

Here is a link to the DangerLands Multiplayer test (PC version). It's just barely running ;)

The Mac version is on its way up soon.
http://daveyounggames.com/downloads/DangerLandsWin32-110809-4.exe

See my previous post about connection issues. Also, you can also just hit Cancel and then Offline to just run around for a bit.

Post anything you want to (bugs, ideas, etc) over on the forums at http://www.dangerlands.com

[Baitntackle54]

tied what you said with the doing the lost password thing and this is what happens

Login denied! Your account has either been blocked or you have not activated it yet. Did you not get an activation e-mail and follow the validation link?
Login denied! Your account has either been blocked or you have not activated it yet. Did you not get an activation e-mail and follow the validation link?
Your password reset request failed because a User with the specified username and e-mail address could not be found..

[daveyoung]

tied what you said with the doing the lost password thing and this is what happens

Login denied! Your account has either been blocked or you have not activated it yet. Did you not get an activation e-mail and follow the validation link?
Login denied! Your account has either been blocked or you have not activated it yet. Did you not get an activation e-mail and follow the validation link?
Your password reset request failed because a User with the specified username and e-mail address could not be found..

I'll forward this on to the web team. Sorry!

[Baitntackle54]

ok thanks. The link above doesn't work. and is that mac one gonna be out tonight?

[kugi_igi]

link doesn't work :D
any updated link ;)

[daveyoung]

link doesn't work :D
any updated link ;)

Updated, curse my eyes!

[kugi_igi]

Updated, curse my eyes!
tnx :D

just downloaded and installed it
i created a player and able to connect to the server,then boom!
my PC hanged :D needed to restart the PC
does this app have any requirements?

[Kunning]

Dave, I can't seem to use a sword or bow... :confused: :(

[kugi_igi]

my PC hanged for the 2nd time :D
maybe this game is not for a very powerful PC like mine ;)

[Baitntackle54]

So what about that mac version?

[daveyoung]

Please post any test issues over on our forums so that the team can find them easily.

kugi_igi, if you click Cancel, then Offline, can you walk around?

[JoshCM]

downloading now - lets see how it runs on my hp pavilion laptop.
its not a powerhouse computer but it gets the job done.

update: I got it running, created my character but can't connect to the server. I don't know if Dave has
turned it off or not. I went into offline mode and ran around for awhile.
Seems like a lot of work to be done but tremendous potential.
I hope it continues to progress so I can keep testing it ;)

[Balu`]

Downloading it now. :)

[daveyoung]

As luck has it, we are already experiencing various server connection issues, so I'm going to put up a very simple multiplayer test template to establish a working baseline today. I do mean simple! I need to figure out if it's the server configuration or the tech itself which is loaning us problems.

Fun! Like I promised...

The existing DangerLands client and server will stay up during this baseline testing.

[Baitntackle54]

It works running bootcamp on my mac. But I wanna run it on my mac. Please hurry with the mac download. Also is the team looking at my forum account problem? Is that also the account that I will log into the game with?

[daveyoung]

Here is a very basic test of client/server communications, using a barebones project. There are *no* game specific elements here whatsoever.

PC version - 4MB (http://www.daveyounggames.com/downloads/MultiplayerTest-PC-2.exe)
Mac version - 5MB (http://www.daveyounggames.com/downloads/MultiplayerTest-Mac-2.zip)

[daveyoung]

It works running bootcamp on my mac. But I wanna run it on my mac. Please hurry with the mac download. Also is the team looking at my forum account problem? Is that also the account that I will log into the game with?

The admin said he has manually activated your account, and the account is not linked to your ingame account.

[Braiton]

Made an account and ran around. Looking quiet nice. However i have been unable to connect to the MultiplayerTest.

[daveyoung]

Made an account and ran around. Looking quite nice. However i have been unable to connect to the MultiplayerTest.

Do you mean that you haven't been able to connect with the small (new) test, or with the original full DangerLands client test?

Please let us know here: http://www.dangerlands.com/

Thanks :)