Kroll's Out

[break5]

http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewSoftware?id=291971999&mt=8

[NotYou]

Touch Arcade posted an article stating it's coming out soon but maybe not by the end of September a few minutes before the game was released.
I find that funny.

[smgschwind]

I can't wait to play this. It's too bad it isn't in the mobile app store yet, I won't be home for a few hours.

[different]

Looks super. :)

I will wait a little and see if there's a price drop, I already bought Reign of Swords on Saturday and I really should be playing that instead of leaving it to sit on my home screen.

[quartex]

Reign of Swords doesn't have anything close to the same quality graphics, but it's got some fun gameplay. I encourage you to check it out.

[NotYou]

I'm waiting a little bit to see if there's a price drop too.

I've also been playing Reign of Swords, so I have plenty to keep me busy. Reign of Swords is the most addicting portable game I've ever played. Once I got ahold of griffon riders and cannons I became a little power crazed.

[nizy]

i posted some first impressions in the comment of the main article on touch arcade. Seems good to me, prob best graphics so far, easily as good as or better than DS and was running smoothly with about 7 or 8 enemies on screen.:D

http://toucharcade.com/2008/09/29/kroll-arrives-in-the-app-store (http://toucharcade.com/2008/09/29/kroll-arrives-in-the-app-store/)

[lw1234]

So far the game is technically extremely impressive, but underwhelming from a gameplay standpoint. It is overwhelmingly repetitive, and while I appreciate the production values, it is SO short. 3 chapters with 3 levels each at about 1-3 minutes per level...it can be beat in well under an hour.

[ticookie]

Def. too short. First chapter took like 5-10 min. Fun to play, just waaaaay too short.

[lw1234]

I know I just posted, but I have to say this is really disappointing. So far there are 4 enemy types (small, small with scorpion tail, large and large with spear and shield). They come in a couple different colors but they are exactly the same. The smaller ones are just annoying and take 1 maybe 2 hits to kill, the larger ones are a little more satisfying, but the largest are the most frustrating. There is no block, and their spear is so long it easily gets you. The bosses are like God of War with no fighting. You tap an area of the screen at the right time and you'll beat it.

There is no jump and no sign of the rope sliding found in the SDK demo. I don't know, I guess I was expecting more. The old beat em ups had a little more variety than this

[nizy]

Def. too short. First chapter took like 5-10 min. Fun to play, just waaaaay too short.

I agree its short and simple, but give the harder difficulty settings a go. Just tried chapter 1, level 1 on hard and found it to be a bit more challenging, with more enemies, surrounding you more often. Might add a bit more depth to the game?

[nizy]

I know I just posted, but I have to say this is really disappointing. So far there are 4 enemy types (small, small with scorpion tail, large and large with spear and shield). They come in a couple different colors but they are exactly the same. The smaller ones are just annoying and take 1 maybe 2 hits to kill, the larger ones are a little more satisfying, but the largest are the most frustrating. There is no block, and their spear is so long it easily gets you. The bosses are like God of War with no fighting. You tap an area of the screen at the right time and you'll beat it.

There is no jump and no sign of the rope sliding found in the SDK demo. I don't know, I guess I was expecting more. The old beat em ups had a little more variety than this

I agree with most of what you say. Like i said in my last reply, try the harder settings.

Have you completed all chapters? Maybe the jump and rope stuff come in later on? Also, could chapters 2 and 3 be longer, more difficult etc?

[BATTLE BORN]

The old beat em ups had a little more variety than this

yea sounds pretty weak with no up/down movement or jumping. as fun as walking to the right and button mashing sounds, maybe I'll try that new dungeon crawler, or chopper instead.

[NotYou]

Here's my 2 cents abut these games.

I'm impressed with the graphics, but from what I've seen of the gameplay, it seem pretty lacking.
The devs bragged that it's meant to have short levels so you can play it on the bus, but I think that's a mistake. It seems to be a lot of devs think making games short is going to make them better on the iPhone.

From my experience, longer games that auto-save when you get a call or close the app are the way to go. Reign of swords is good about that. One game can take half an hour or more (sometimes much more), but you can quit at anytime and come right back to it.

If Kroll had normal sized levels and just auto-saved at checkpoints, I'd buy it in a heartbeat. Right now it seems to be just another game that they purposefully toned down because they thought people would want that.

I'm not ruling it out. I am going to wait until I see some more reviews, though.

[lw1234]

Just finished the game....wow was I disappointed. The only variation in the entire game is the boss battles and the last one is so cheap. It gives you about 2 tenths of a second to push the right area and immediately takes one of your lives each time. Get game over and it is back to the beginning of the CHAPTER, not level.

The graphics are so good but totally wasted on copy and paste level design. Each level is EXACTLY the same. And no, the later levels do NOT have any of the cool acrobatic stuff shown in the SDK demo. There is not one flip, not one jump, and certainly not one rope slide. That bat the hero bitch slaps in the 40 second demo video? Doesn't exist. The jump swing that the hero does to hit the bat? Also doesn't exist. There are two three move combos, but the game is 100% button masher to the worst degree.

I wasn't expecting a PSP game, but I honestly don't think the developer put any time into anything but the menus and the graphics. The game looks great but makes me miss my 8 dollars. I bought Real Soccer 2009 for 10 and I have not ONCE missed my 10 dollars.

Sigh....

[dudehuge]

Just finished the game....wow was I disappointed. The only variation in the entire game is the boss battles and the last one is so cheap. It gives you about 2 tenths of a second to push the right area and immediately takes one of your lives each time. Get game over and it is back to the beginning of the CHAPTER, not level.

The graphics are so good but totally wasted on copy and paste level design. Each level is EXACTLY the same. And no, the later levels do NOT have any of the cool acrobatic stuff shown in the SDK demo. There is not one flip, not one jump, and certainly not one rope slide. That bat the hero bitch slaps in the 40 second demo video? Doesn't exist. The jump swing that the hero does to hit the bat? Also doesn't exist. There are two three move combos, but the game is 100% button masher to the worst degree.

I wasn't expecting a PSP game, but I honestly don't think the developer put any time into anything but the menus and the graphics. The game looks great but makes me miss my 8 dollars. I bought Real Soccer 2009 for 10 and I have not ONCE missed my 10 dollars.

Sigh....

*sigh* I was hoping this game turns out to be good, oh well. I'm waiting for it to drop to 99 cents which by current trends will be in 2 weeks. :)

[davidmdowning42]

Short was my worry. When a game is long the blurbs brag about how many levels it has. When they didn't, I got suspicious. I'm a big enough Star Wars geek to have bought Unleashed at full price & not completely regret it. But I ain't doin' nothin' like that again- not for more than say, $2.

[ReformatPlanet]

Sounds like an expensive tech demo. I had strong doubts when i saw the preview video, but i didn't expect the design to actually take steps backward.

I'll continue to play Reign of Swords and enjoy the hell out of it.

[NotYou]

That's my plan so far. Even with its simple graphics, that game has held my attention firmly since it came out.

I keep mentioning it in posts, but there's a reason for that. If the online fights weren't automatic it'd be a little too good. I would never get anything done.

[renton]

wow! i wish i read this thread b4 i bought it. tho i do like the game; it's just a shame devs think we have to have shorter games to keep us interested in the iphone/itouch.

i hope they release a patch that contains a few more levels, esp. the bits that are in the video. i saw the vid, and thats when i decided to buy the game flat out.

all i have to say, everyone, use the review in the app store to tell everyone what you all have said. maybe that might have the devs think twice...

im going too....

[dckura]

Hey guys, I just finished this game on hard, here's my full review:

Gameplay: 4/10
In summary, the gameplay is simply shallow. You can only move left and right, you can't even jump. Enemies attack from both directions while you slowly make your way to the right and eventually encounter the boss, it's the same formula in every chapter, and it quickly becomes repetitive. There are 3 chapters and 3 short levels in each chapter. Each chapter has a well-drawn story that you can read. On hard I finished the game in about 30 minutes.

You have 2 attacks, quick swing and hard swing, and there aren't any defensive moves. The movement and attacks are activated by pressing buttons on the side of the screen. As you kill enemies your weapon power builds up and glows red and does more damage. You also have one special move that uses life force, it knocks back surrounding enemies, this is activated by shaking the iPhone or touching your character. The shaking is a completely useless feature and interrupts the gameplay, it seems to be a gimmick so they could say they used the accelerometer. If your life force is full and you die you'll be revived on the spot rather than starting at the beginning of the level, so there's a choice of whether to use your special move or not.

The simple control system isn't aided at all by the lack of variety in enemies, there are pretty much 3 enemies and 1 boss. In each chapter the 3 enemies are themed differently, but their behaviour is mostly the same. Scorpions constantly bombard you from each side, while bigger brutes stand in your way, and then at the end of the level there's the mini-boss character that has a shield and a spear. You button mash attack through the 2 kinds of enemies, and then against the spear mini-boss you run backward to dodge his spear (because you can't block) then attack. That's it, that's the whole level, rinse and repeat for all 9 levels!

The entire game you are running right on a rail, and the camera is on a rail too. Once you encounter the boss you are just completely on rails, as you have just one button. Each chapter boss plays out like a cinematic, and it's the same boss every time. As the fight between you and the boss plays out in a cinematic, a symbol appears and you have to quickly touch it. If you miss, you die and have to restart the boss. You have only 3 lives, so you can very quickly lose your lives in the span of 15 seconds and then have to start at the beginning of the chapter again. I found that the action just happens so fast, the entire boss plays out in 30 seconds or less, so your eyes are glued to the screen waiting for symbols to press, you have no time to pay attention to what's going on in the cinematic, nor do you care, because where the symbols appear is mostly arbitrary. In the end, the beautiful cinematic ends up being just a distraction.

Graphics: 8/10
Kroll gives a good idea the graphics iPhone can handle, but leaves much to be desired. The environment is colourful and gorgeous, it seems to be a fantasy themed volcanic island. You start at a beach, go through a volcano, and end up in a stone-filled fantasy mountainous region. It's gorgeous but there is little variation, and the backgrounds including the water and lava are mostly static with little movement. There's *zero* interaction with the environment, you just walk right. The enemies are simple and with just 3 types, it gets old fast. There's some effects when you hit enemies and use your special move, but actually nothing outstanding. The cinematics of the boss fight are pretty to watch, but are over quickly. With the simplistic boss fighting you wonder why they don't just pre-render the cinematic and play it as a movie. There's some dynamic lighting on the characters and a simple circular drop-shadow.

Sound: 6/10
The sound in the cinematics is great, but the sound effects you hear most, during the gameplay, are highly repetitive and don't use 3D sound location for left-ear / right-ear. The music is cinematic, high quality, and fits the theme of Kroll.

Presentation: 8/10
The menu is interesting as it's 3D and done in pages of a book. You can flip through the book to select your level, access help, and read the story for each chapter. The help is thorough and explains all aspects of the gameplay. The chapter stories are simple but accompanied by skillfully drawn art. There's a lack of polish here, as there are some minor artifacts when the pages flip.

Value : 3/10
This is where the game really flops, because here you have to factor in the price. The game is finished in 30 minutes or less and there is zero incentive to replay with just one unlockable, no other game modes, no multi-player. A score of enemies killed, lives lost etc. is tabulated at the end of each level but there is no high score. There is one unlockable difficulty (insane mode), but the game is just frustrating at higher difficulties -- the AI isn't smarter and more interesting, they just do things like throw more damn scorpions at you so you die faster. This game was built to be played through once, maybe twice, and because of the novelty of the high quality graphics, I'd say a good price point would be $4.

Overall: 5/10
High production value with little gameplay. After 30 minutes all I get is a pretty showpiece for my friends. The only time I'm going to fire this game up again is to demo the pretty graphics of the iPhone. This game belongs at an Apple convention on a big screen, not on my personal iPhone that I'll carry on me for years. These graphics and production values are slowly becoming standard on the iPhone, so the novelty value will be short-lived, and this game will be sadly forgotten.

[ReformatPlanet]

Great review. Good job. Game sounds even worse then i imagined. Whats the deal with that? Interesting that a studio could produce such good graphics with terrible game play.

Second thought, that happens all the time, doesn't it?

[dckura]

Thanks. It does happen all the time because graphics take a considerable amount of effort to produce. Developers of 3D games can get carried away and need to look for a balance.

[wastedyuthe]

Wow. There are a couple of good comments for this game on the TouchArcade post about it, so I watched the video (the new one) and posted this-

"Looks boring if you ask me! I was falling asleep watching that. Walk, attack, walk, attack to the right, attack to the left, walk,attack, walk, attack, yawn, yawn…zzzzzzzzzz"

From the sounds of all the comments on this thread, I was right. I'm steering well clear.
I would just like to echo what someone else said to everyone on here who has played it- PLEASE post your review on iTunes so the devs will sit up and take notice of all the complaints.
It seems most of the reviews on iTunes are POSITIVE, with only a few commenting on the repetitive and lacking gameplay. It seems most people like to post reviews if they are positive, and most people come to forums to complain, lol!

[Oliver]

I took a look at a few YouTube videos and while it looks amazing, the gameplay even in the first level was very boring. You just do the same every time.

[dckura]

I already posted my review on iTunes, but I was only able to post it on the Canadian App Store.

[nizy]

I just saw iPhone Central's review of the game and it says if you complete the "insane" difficulty you'll unlock a 4th level (Chapter?). Anybody done this? I've completed "easy" and 2 chapters of "Hard" so far, will post if i unlock the new level.

http://www.macworld.com/article/135829/2008/10/kroll.html

Also just a side note to all the poor reviews here, Digital Legends stated way back at WWDC that it was a throwback to the old beat 'em ups like golden axe and streets of rage, so you should know that your not gonna get a massive variety in the gameplay. The game is faithful to its roots, so if, like me you enjoyed those games, you'll like this. I would've liked to see some of the jumps/rope slide etc. but am quite happy as is. Also its a cheap game ($8 isn't much really - considering your average DS game will set you back a lot more), and is played on a mobile phone so you shouldn't be expecting a Zelda like adventure! Mobile games need to be playable in small segments, which is the case here.

I've enjoyed it quite a bit, even more so on "Hard" difficulty as there is much more of a challenge to it. By this I mean more enemies to kill and the boss stages are more difficult too. On 1st boss, on easy, i only had to press icon 4 times, with a good few secs interval between them. On hard, i had about 8, 4 of which occurred within 4 seconds! Now think what Insane must be like?

I think people have stupid expectations for an $8 game! If you want a longer game, then you will have to pay more for it cos' it'll take em longer and cost more to make it. Its similar to wiiware really.

[arn]

Also just a side note to all the poor reviews here, Digital Legends stated way back at WWDC that it was a throwback to the old beat 'em ups like golden axe and streets of rage, so you should know that your not gonna get a massive variety in the gameplay. The game is faithful to its roots, so if, like me you enjoyed those games, you'll like this.

I agree that people complain about price too much. For a good game $10 is fine. Honestly for a really good game I don't think people shouldn't have a problem paying $20 or more.

The problem I had with Kroll was that those old games like Golden Axe were much better games. There's a lot more to making a good game than pretty graphics. There needs to be a balance of actual skill or flexibilty in gameplay that distinguishes good players from bad players. There needs to be a reason to come back and play the game more. To feel like you can actually do something "right" or "better" to make it through a level.

Kroll involved hitting the attack button towards the left or right.

I died at the final boss because I couldn't hit the skull fast enough. That's really not the kind of skill I feel like is worth my time to play the third level again and again just so I can time those presses just right.

Adding jumping and blocking and a variety of enemies would have done a lot for gameplay. Also increasing difficulty in levels would have been nice. I could see they thought about it a little. There was an area where spikes rose up from the ground. I was a little hopeful when I saw that.... but in the end that was as creative as they got.

I mean think of it this way ... remove the fancy graphics. What's left? Is that a game you would recommend or play? Would you pay $8? I mean all those old games had crappy graphics, but we played them again and again.

arn

[davidmdowning42]

played on a mobile phone so you shouldn't be expecting a Zelda like adventure! Mobile games need to be playable in small segments, which is the case here.

I played & beat every single Zelda Game (not 64 or later) but NES, SNES, Gameboy, & Gameboy Color on my Handspring PHONE using the Little John Palm emulator, and I never missed a call! (The GBA version doesn't count since it was just the SNES version re-released.) How was this possible? Emulators let you save the game amy time, any place. Every game can be played in small segments if you can just do that. A very simple concept.

I would also be willing to pay much more for a REAL game. There are a few already- Bugdom, Swords, etc, but those are cheap too. Worries me.

[wastedyuthe]

I agree that people complain about price too much. For a good game $10 is fine. Honestly for a really good game I don't think people shouldn't have a problem paying $20 or more.

The problem I had with Kroll was that those old games like Golden Axe were much better games. There's a lot more to making a good game than pretty graphics. There needs to be a balance of actual skill or flexibilty in gameplay that distinguishes good players from bad players. There needs to be a reason to come back and play the game more. To feel like you can actually do something "right" or "better" to make it through a level.

Kroll involved hitting the attack button towards the left or right.

I died at the final boss because I couldn't hit the skull fast enough. That's really not the kind of skill I feel like is worth my time to play the third level again and again just so I can time those presses just right.

Adding jumping and blocking and a variety of enemies would have done a lot for gameplay. Also increasing difficulty in levels would have been nice. I could see they thought about it a little. There was an area where spikes rose up from the ground. I was a little hopeful when I saw that.... but in the end that was as creative as they got.

I mean think of it this way ... remove the fancy graphics. What's left? Is that a game you would recommend or play? Would you pay $8? I mean all those old games had crappy graphics, but we played them again and again.

arn

EXACTLY right Arn. Those older games had more to them than this- in Golden Axe for example, you could jump attack, climb onto creatures and attack using their tails, and hit little pixie guys to build up your magic. There was a small amount of strategy with when you should use your magic (save it up for a more powerful spell). Even Double Dragon had different weapons to pick up on the way and pits to jump over etc.

[Oliver]

Mobile games need to be playable in small segments, which is the case here.

Your are mixing platform and usage. *Mobile games* are also available on the DS or PSP, since they are, by definition, mobile game consoles. There are games which I could play for hours and days, but if I want to stop, I just close my DS and the game autopauses itself. When I want to play again, I open my DS and the game is where I left it. This is a feature *every* game has on top of its save system! And the iPhone games work the same way: Press home, the game pauses, restart the game and the game continous. So, of course we should have huge games with hours and days of gameplay on the iPhone/iPod Touch like we have on DS and PSP! It's the same market, the same technique, the same pause system, the same mobile usage.

However, most *mobile* games are just small ones, because you have a small screen, a damn java virtual machine and about 20 different input methods and screen sizes, not much ram, not much space for the game, no flatrate to download the games etc. That's a limitation of the hardware and software. We don't have this limitation on the iPhone or iPod touch.

[Nightflower]

This is a terrific game. Raises the bar on graphics and funfactor. It was a little short though. Can't wait for an expansion!

[inferi22]

im having trouble on the big guys with the swords can anyone help