An alternative formula for success on the iphone/itouch

Discussion in 'Public Game Developers Forum' started by cubytes, Sep 19, 2009.

  1. cubytes

    cubytes Well-Known Member

    Aug 25, 2009
    501
    0
    0
    #1 cubytes, Sep 19, 2009
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2009
    The typical mind-set right now on how to make bank on the digital distribution nature of this platform is basically to push apps to the store as fast as you can if they do well! awesome if they dont "oh well" you got another one about to drop and hopefully you dont go bankrupt before it hits the store.....

    Theres also the issue of price since everyone is trying to rush products to the store so fast they are driving the price points down it started at 9.99 then went to 5/6 dollars and now we are floating around 99 cents to 3 dollars or products come out at 9.99 then drop to 5.99 then on to 2.99 and then finally settles at .99 cents where it will remain forever.....


    most of the "advice" you read on blogs like techchrunch follow this philosophy drive sales by dropping the price and basically de-vaule your game/franchise oh wow what a great idea right? this is how the market works on other platforms just on a longer cycle great right? wrong! because when you launch random game 2 you have a delima now random game 1 is .99c to 2.99$ and your trying to play the price point game all over again at 9.99 - 6.99 thats a hard sell when random game 1 is sitting right next to random game 2

    so heres my philosophy on this.......

    ignore the typical advice and put everything you got into a game to make it great dont rush it

    ignore the price game do the exact opposite....choice a price point at like 2.99-5.99 and leave it untouched dont play the price game trust me just stick with a low price dont "de-value" the game at ALL ever add "value" to it instead :)

    when you get a hit support it and turn it into a franchise if its the last thing you do on this earth........ this is absolutely essential to create and build franchises and support them with everything you got -- the franchise means everything

    for instance -- tower defense games a huge explosion of those on the platform right? fieldrunners being the "big" hit in this genre, we can all agree on that right?

    what have they done since then? they got on the psp WOW!! how many maps did they release as DLC? what other game modes did they release? what other types of games did they make with the same art style but with different gameplay mechanics and/or different genres? do they even have a fieldrunners 2 planned? do they have a site where you can play all kinds of field runner related games online? do they have a fan app?

    do you get my drift?

    Heres how it breaks down:

    -updates should be technical improvements and bug fixes and or compatibility issues ONLY absolutely NO content whatsoever...PERIOD!!!

    -content should be - DLC ONLY via in app purchases and as separate tittles/games on the app store at the same time even if its just a map or just a new level after the game before the game during the game or where ever the context of the DLC fits in the story/franchise it doesn't matter consider the DLC now an extension of your product and as a "lite version" of your product at the same time but its not freeee :)

    when your ready to improve the game for the sake of this example im using fieldrunners still lets say they want to add a new freestyle mode, some new towers and new runners and new maps instead of selling it as fieldrunners 2 sell it as what i call a mash up product and a "in app add-on product" at the same time.

    the mash up product can be called "game of the year edition" or "gold edition" with an increased price and you can get all of the DLCs, game modes all of the maps and new features as well as "unique" features all in one new awesome package you can spin that into whatever marketing camp you want and you can thank me later :)

    and of course you still have the in app "add-on" product a considerably lower priced product but in app purchase ONLY but you can still make money here and it gets the gamer updated to all of the new features but they still have to obtain the rest of the "new maps" via separate DLC purchases and you dont get the "unique" features that comes with the mash up

    when your ready to break the bank again prepare some teams to throw down a ton of games for this franchise one after another following the same formula as mentioned above

    first off get an online presence up and running as fast as possible and why not try to branch out on new platforms while your at it

    at this point you want to push some mini games out as fast as you can as teasers that will also be playable online in flash games you can push them for free or charge .99 cents whatever you decide this is just building the fire if you will

    then when your ready to light the fire drop a fully realized fieldrunners "RTS game" or have it third person action game whatever it is that pushed forward the franchise it doesn't matter all that matters is that this is the money maker it should have a solid development cycle with no stone left untouched put everything you have into these games and you will break the bank on each and every one of them while keeping the attention and hype going with teasers and mini game launches

    make sure to ONLY cross promote all of the franchise specific products together

    hell you can even create franchise fan apps with developer commentary and interviews, walkthrus and strategy guides fan art backgrounds, fan content like ringtones and dont forget its also a news outlet itself to push sm marketing events and upcoming product news associated with the franchise which you should already be pushing avidly trying to push on as many mediums as you can anyways so its a win win :)

    when the franchise is still hot make sure to organize an ace team to ponder and design a new high quality product to start a new franchise and have it reconsidered and reconsidered a million times until its a sure thing thats ready to go to immediate development as soon as the previous franchise starts to become stagnant or if your really rolling in the cash just go forward with it and run multiple franchises side by side back to back and ongoing and just drop the production of content slowly over time when they start to get stagnant

    Conclusion......

    this formula gives you complete flexibility - you want to have all the DLC together in one app great buy the game for 5.99 and get the DLCs via in app purchases for 99 cents from now on you want a lite version great get the DLCs in the app store for 99cents to 1.99, oh you just want the new features but not all the content from the game of the year edition great get the add on from the in app purchase only available from inside the real game not the lite versions :)
     
  2. cubytes

    cubytes Well-Known Member

    Aug 25, 2009
    501
    0
    0
    marketing genius? or baseless ramblings from a sleep deprived goober ;)

    what do you guys think?

    D
     
  3. Stroffolino

    Stroffolino Well-Known Member
    Patreon Silver

    Apr 28, 2009
    1,100
    8
    38
    Software Engineer
    Pennsylvania
    Your post is a mix of common sense, unsupported speculation, and some legitimate good ideas.
     
  4. Slayer_megadeth

    Slayer_megadeth Well-Known Member

    Nov 11, 2008
    381
    3
    0
    Student
    India
    geez 10/10 for the patience.
     
  5. ScottColbert

    ScottColbert Well-Known Member

    If I followed that advice, I'd be bankrupt in a week. You have no clue about business.
     
  6. cubytes

    cubytes Well-Known Member

    Aug 25, 2009
    501
    0
    0
    exactly what advice are you referring to? maybe I didn't take something into consideration?
     
  7. Touchsmiths

    Touchsmiths Well-Known Member

    Apr 12, 2009
    57
    0
    0
    iPhone Game Developer
    Richmond, VA

    You have some decent ideas elsewhere in your post but i have to nitpick about this one.

    The value of a product to a business is how much revenue it generates. Not some objective criteria of what the developer thinks it's worth.

    $0.99 = 1000 sales. $2.99 = 50 sales.

    I will price my games at $0.99.
     
  8. cubytes

    cubytes Well-Known Member

    Aug 25, 2009
    501
    0
    0
    @Touchsmiths

    ahh yes agreed 2.99-5.99 is a considerably harder price point to sell in then .99 cents if you want to price your product at .99 cents right off the bat thats fine its definitely starting low

    the basic philosophy here is to start low and add value........

    in my post I was mostly referring to high production value content targeted at DS and PsP owners the big games backed with plenty of capital and resources readily available and/or jackpots, hits that rise to the top if you make it claim it franchise it branch out and OWN it basically support it with everything you got solidify it and establish a presence instead of trying to re-roll the dice and hit the jackpot again with "random game 2"

    targeting the casual market on a low/limited budget is a completely different beast all together :)
     
  9. In my experience, price alone doesn't influence overall revenue a huge amount. I think pricing depends more on if you're in a highly competitive niche or not.
     
  10. Touchsmiths

    Touchsmiths Well-Known Member

    Apr 12, 2009
    57
    0
    0
    iPhone Game Developer
    Richmond, VA


    Absolutely... I was simplifying the process quite a bit for the purpose of discussion.
     
  11. mobile1up

    mobile1up Well-Known Member

    Nov 6, 2008
    754
    0
    16
    Technical Director
    Munich, Germany
    it actually makes sense. there are some exceptions tho; and, these are the ones mentioned on techcrunch et al. the reality for most developers is that they don't get the exposure that they need to make it big.

    Mobile 1UP has been a developer since october 2008; and, in the beginning - we got exposure, lots of it. as a result - we had sales. we got reviews, articles in news papers, magazines.. but - we never had apple itunes coverage. it was almost cloud nine.. we had $1.99 apps - we should have made them $0.99 and potentially made a killing (if all the news you here is right)

    since Nintendo forced us to remove our games; we had to build new ones - and we truely miss the spot light.. our games started at $1.99 - as the originals did, and sales dropped.. we made them $0.99, sales doubled - so; the end result was that it didnt really matter. after months; sales became a slow trickle - basically, those who buy, would have bought it at whatever the cost.. so, we put the price back up to 1.99 - since the price increase; we haven't seen half the sales, in fact, its been the same.

    we just released Chain Rxn for free - at the hope of bringing some viral marketing to the other games; we will see how that goes. end result; do some good related games, build a brand.. release a freebie every now and then - it doesn't hurt! our next game (in the works) will trickle out slowly... we'll eventually see if there is life on the iPhone / iPod Touch along side the big players like EA et al.
     
  12. ElectricGrandpa

    ElectricGrandpa Well-Known Member

    Sep 5, 2009
    344
    0
    0
    Game Developer
    Brampton, Ontario
    Some decent ideas here, but keep in mind that the most valuable thing is TIME. If you spend months and months working on a game and then it doesn't do well, you've wasted your time. It's probably better to do a bunch of relatively simple ideas to see what works, and then if something sticks, you do a more extensive/polished version of that.

    The problem is that a lot of devs don't seem to have a good sense of what other people are gonna like. It's really easy to like your own game, but other people might not.
     
  13. Mike_011972

    Mike_011972 Well-Known Member

    Dec 30, 2008
    83
    0
    0
    People have to see your game first!

    I personally think that the biggest problem is getting your game seen by other people. Price isn’t that big an issue as long as it’s not too much ($3 been the maximum I would pay unless it had lots of good reviews as I think thats the top of the “Give a try” impulse buy range) as I think most people are willing to take a chance if it’s something that sparks the players interest.

    The big problem is actually getting the player to see and try your game first. Just had a quick look through my iTunes Connect and I think the Free version of Solitaire Siege has been downloaded just over 1000 times in two weeks, which is pretty poor compared to the 40 Million+ devices out there and that’s down to a lack of reviews on the bigger sites (I think), with Touch Arcade been the big one I think (it has had a about 4 reviews all of which has been really good, but if a lot of people don’t see the reviews then they wont to buy it).

    It appears you need to be more of a business man then a developer to make your money on the App Store. Just tread what you have learnt from this and try not to make the same mistakes next time as I’m sure for most of use, it’s the idea of making fun games that people all over the world play, is one of the main reasons for doing it. It would be nice to make some cash back from all the hard work and long hours of course ;)

    And on that note, check my game out ;)

    Solitaire Siege Intro
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0PrALCxAeGM
    Solitaire Siege Weapons
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v9-vydhISV0
    Solitaire Siege Game Play
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dmQc97iYvw

    App Store Links:
    Full
    http://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewSoftware?id=326694249&mt=8
    LITE
    http://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewSoftware?id=329619033&mt=8

    Thanks,
    Mike Moore.
    App Store Link:
    Solitaire Siege Game Page
    Follow me on Twitter
     
  14. EFC

    EFC Well-Known Member

    Jul 6, 2009
    93
    0
    0
    Game Developer
    Ill second that
    I priced mine at $0.99 because looking at whats out there and for half an hour of arcade game, i truely believe thats what its worth.
    Id also add, there are plenty of games on this forum that are basic ripoffs of current games... like flight control... that took 5 minutes to think off. and yet have amazing support here, because they were pulled off well.
    my next title needs to be ninja pirate ragdoll zombie control..
    maybe then ill make back the dev costs.

    no point feeling bitter about it.. as was mentioned.. learn from it and move on.
    psp dev kits only a couple of grand now. id get into that and be an early adopter if i didnt have to pay for code. and you know its gonna take more coding than an iphone game of the same.

    i get pretty offended by sales.. even if it is peanuts we are talking about.
    but fact is it works, its a fickle market.. try everything you can.
    i see alot of apps using updates to put them back on a page at apple, its another avenue of marketing.. is it clogging the system .. or just doing what everyone else is doing.

    some guy recently released an adventure game that had poor graphics ( judging it by the competitions standard ) at $9.99 and people here were pretty offended.. which i can totally see... but .. fair play to the guy.
    if id sold two at 9.99 id have made more money than ive made ever selling it at 0.99, but .. id have been called a rip off merchant.. which would have been spot on.. but my accountant would have been happier.

    my advice, dont make my mistake.
    keep your dev costs at zero and you cant really be dissapointed.
    all youll have lost is your time and maybe youll have a cool little app that at least you like.
     
  15. Mike_011972

    Mike_011972 Well-Known Member

    Dec 30, 2008
    83
    0
    0
    @EFC
    First off, you really need to do a Benny Hill version of your game (if your not English and quickly approaching your 40’s you will have no idea what I’m on about, just Google Benny Hill), that would make me buy your game straight away =)

    To be honest, that’s one of the things that I am surprised at on the iPhone / iPod is what people expect from a $1 game and “hum and ahhing” about getting the game, which surly you have nothing to lose at that price (I have bought a lot of stinkers), but at a $1, its not a big deal.

    Well for me, I’m going to try advertising the game on websites before moving on to the other games I have planned and see if that makes any difference to sales.

    Cheers,
    Mike Moore.
     
  16. EFC

    EFC Well-Known Member

    Jul 6, 2009
    93
    0
    0
    Game Developer
    #16 EFC, Sep 21, 2009
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2009
    Mike_011972...lol... i used benny hill in my marketing schpiel... ( yep im english and quickly approaching 40)
    the kids dont know him.. and i doubt theyve heard of krakatoa either.
    maybe im too old school for this, i used to develop for the n64 hahaha.
    i think next time ill go for a publisher, if my games are any good .. theylll get picked up.. right.

    oh and if youre going to use buysell advertising.. it hasnt worked for me..
    99 bucks for 30 days on pocket gamer uk.. 103 clicks.. maybe 1 sale. ( by day 21 )
    199 bucks for 30 days on 148 apps 100 clicks.. possibly no sales. ( by day 21 )
    with no way to track click IPs i cant tell if its just the owner clicking on my ads.
    of 25 review sites..i sent mails and promos to. i got 1 preview.
     
  17. EssentialParadox

    EssentialParadox Well-Known Member

    Sep 21, 2009
    602
    0
    0
    UK / Toronto
    Nah, you guys have got it all wrong… You need to price it at $999.99 and then you'll only need to get a few sales.


    In all seriousness though, I have a large marketing background and feel the points in the original post are pretty sound. I've been to the Fieldrunners forums and they're asking users what new weapons and maps they want included in future updates and then they're not really making the most of that opportunity for a Field Runners 2.

    I do think the pricing structure is very odd in the App store due to the fact that nobody has a profit margin except for the 30% overhead from Apple's cut. But that 30% remains constant whether it's $0.99 or $9.99. Currently the ethos on the App store seems to be somewhere between devs trying to underbid each other and grabbing the users who are on the fence into an impulse buy.

    It's interesting because I think for those really great and hyped games, like Fieldrunners, I'd easily have paid $5-10 for, but the fact it was only $0.99 had no bearing on my purchase. I think the hardcore fans who are willing to pay more, can certainly be leveraged more. To expand a bit on cubytes post, I think a great idea would be for devs to price at $0.99 initially, tweak the game to perfection, but then immediately begin a sequel that is bigger and better and then place it at a higher price point. You'll be able to leverage off fans, but you'll also be able to continue funneling new fans from the original, which will still be on the market. Then you can do a 3rd version, drop the sequel down to $0.99. All the other ideas about "behind the scenes" apps and leveraging the franchise are all good too.

    Familiarity is an incredibly powerful tool. At the moment on the App store, it's a sea of nobody's and nothing's. But if you can get people familiar with your gameplay, characters, or universe you can use that to make a very successful brand. Think about Halo… there's the basic Halo trilogy… but then there's the Halo Wars RTS game, Halo ODST, Halo Reach… These games vary into other genres, but people buy them out of familiarity. And when you've got that familiarity among a nice fanbase, you'll have no trouble selling your apps at $5 each.
     
  18. Catacomber

    Catacomber Well-Known Member

    May 21, 2009
    1,320
    0
    0
    http://www.zaristagames.com/
    NYC
    I think .99 cents is a good selling point for 2 reasons: (1) the economy, (2) a lot of players are under the age where they have jobs--they have to beg their parents or just rely on the gift cards they get for birthdays or other holidays and .99 cents is appealing. But even at .99 cents your game has to be fun. So if your game is .99 cents and fun (like Pocket God), you should have a hit! That's my philosophy.
     

Share This Page