Magic 2013

[krautboy]

Originally Posted by Gabrien

This might sound like a strange request, but can anyone help me enjoy this game? I really like the art, setting, interface, but I just can't seem to be able to get into the gameplay at all. The rules just feel so...arbitrary. Ths card does this, and this card does that...well why does it do "this" or "that?" There just doesn't appear to be any inherent logic to any of it and nothing feels intuitive.

I keep thinking there is some "hook" I must be missing, but the penny just won't drop. Perhaps I just have a blind spot for the genre; I've never really been able to get into any other card games like this one either, just thought with the reputation this one has it might be my best shot. But no dice. Any suggestions?

What might help is to stick for a while with one deck. Play with it untill you've seen all cards in play. It might be that you get that ahh feeling. Suddenly it pops and you see the synergy between cards and you get a sense of the strategy for that deck. Sometimes you think that a card is total crap but with the right cards in play you see it's actually very usefull. It takes time to really learn a deck,Magic is not excactly a pick up & play game. That's all advice i can give you,i really hope the dice will roll for you because it's an awesome game.

[sapphire_neo]

$9.99 is such a steal for this. It's a little disheartening that a major section of the TA card gaming community will be left out.

[badmanj]

Originally Posted by Gabrien

This might sound like a strange request, but can anyone help me enjoy this game? I really like the art, setting, interface, but I just can't seem to be able to get into the gameplay at all. The rules just feel so...arbitrary. Ths card does this, and this card does that...well why does it do "this" or "that?" There just doesn't appear to be any inherent logic to any of it and nothing feels intuitive.

I keep thinking there is some "hook" I must be missing, but the penny just won't drop. Perhaps I just have a blind spot for the genre; I've never really been able to get into any other card games like this one either, just thought with the reputation this one has it might be my best shot. But no dice. Any suggestions?

I know what you mean - I played MTG from the first Alpha release for about ten years and I LOVED the game... but I've bought this app and though it's admittedly amazing, beautifully done etc... it doesn't have the same 'hook' that the card game used to have for me.

And I *think* it's because what I enjoyed most was constructing the deck - balancing things out, ensuring there's good synergy between the cards, mana balance etc. This aspect of the game is pretty much lost in this implementation.

Really wish there was the option in this - even as an 'ultimate' unlockable - where you could construct a deck from all the cards you'd unlocked, from all the decks you'd unlocked. That would be SO cool...

Having said all of this, I love to have ANY implementation of MTG on my iPad - that in itself is awesome... and regarding price point, I would have happily paid anything up to $30-40 for this in a heartbeat so $10 is a steal.

Jamie.

[andsoitgoes]

Originally Posted by Gabrien

This might sound like a strange request, but can anyone help me enjoy this game? I really like the art, setting, interface, but I just can't seem to be able to get into the gameplay at all. The rules just feel so...arbitrary. Ths card does this, and this card does that...well why does it do "this" or "that?" There just doesn't appear to be any inherent logic to any of it and nothing feels intuitive.

I keep thinking there is some "hook" I must be missing, but the penny just won't drop. Perhaps I just have a blind spot for the genre; I've never really been able to get into any other card games like this one either, just thought with the reputation this one has it might be my best shot. But no dice. Any suggestions?

I think MtG is a love it or hate it game. The variety and fun of the cards was always a huge draw to me. It's the only card game that I felt a sense of love and adoration towards. I bought the cards, and collected them for their looks as well as their performance. I still have my cards, even though I haven't played in years upon years.

I just don't think this is for you, maybe. It's a shame, because for me there is something so special and fun here.

Originally Posted by dancj

Why? So that the devs feel good about themselves in the knowledge that the people who are spending money are spending a lot? Why can't they get the same joy from knowing that millions of people are playing the game - spending less each, but making the devs more money?

Because cheaper price does not necessarily equal more sales. Because why should developers compromise their pricing for the sake of people who don't want to pay more? Where does that ever work or happen? Steam, maybe, but not in the way you're wanting. We are spoiled on ios and to take a game that is of this caliber, or the caliber of other games I mentioned, and expect... Nay, demand they lower their price is something that seems to only fly in the minds of iOS gamers.

Originally Posted by dancj

All I'm getting from this is a sense from you feel that something of a high quality 'should' have price to match - even if it costs the publishers money to do so. That makes no business sense for digital downloads. Unlike with physical objects, if a publisher can half the price to make more than double the number of sales then they will make more money, so they'd be silly not to do it.

(Obviously I have no idea whether dropping the price of the IAP would make them more money. It's the idea that they should keep prices high regrdless of profit because of some concept of what the software is "worth" that completely baffles me.)

Yes, a high quality game with high production values and that has this much depth to it, or with Carcassonne, etc, many of the other board/card games on the app store deserves to be priced high.

Just because a product is digital doesn't mean that it is worth a dollar. Sure, they might sell more at a dollar, or $5, but why should they? That mentality doesn't make any sense. It really doesn't. It's digital price is $10. That's the cross platform price. It may have cost less to put onto the app store, but are you even considering the effort they put in to port the game here, in the full way it operates on current gen consoles? Isn't that worth it? I think it is. And it would create fragmentation and lots of consumer uproar to price the same game on a different platform a lower price when the price point is this low. The only place that a lower price for a similar game flies is for, say, the Wii and sometimes for the PC version.

Dropping the price "just because" devalues the game. You cannot compare the price of this game to, say, Angry Birds, or loads of the other <$5 games. It just doesn't work like that.

[Unseen Studios]

Originally Posted by dancj

Why? So that the devs feel good about themselves in the knowledge that the people who are spending money are spending a lot? Why can't they get the same joy from knowing that millions of people are playing the game - spending less each, but making the devs more money?


All I'm getting from this is a sense from you feel that something of a high quality 'should' have price to match - even if it costs the publishers money to do so. That makes no business sense for digital downloads. Unlike with physical objects, if a publisher can half the price to make more than double the number of sales then they will make more money, so they'd be silly not to do it.

(Obviously I have no idea whether dropping the price of the IAP would make them more money. It's the idea that they should keep prices high regrdless of profit because of some concept of what the software is "worth" that completely baffles me.)

Some gamers seem to think they are entitled to games that are free or are the cheapest $0.99 option.
Why should you be able to buy this pretty faithful and almost exact replication of a current console and PC game for less just because it is on a portable device?

Magic is a very niche market, it simply does not appeal to a massive amount of gamers so why should it go for mass market prices?

[Blublub]

I was loving this so far, but just had a serious WTF moment that I think is a pretty major bug. Playing against the AI I noticed that it somehow has more than four copies of cards in its deck. The AI had a total of seven Fog Banks in play at the same time in one game (it would play one each turn since the beginning of the match) and in a different game had six Howling Mines (which resulted in a quick deck depletion win for them). In both cases there were no other spells in play that might create copies of cards.

Having more than four in play at one time was the first proof of what I suspected from the first match in campaign mode but chalked up to my missing something (like a card allowing casting from the graveyard): it somehow has way more than four copies of some cards in its deck. That violates a pretty fundamental MTG rule and wrecks what is otherwise a good implementation of the console title.

Anyone else notice this or am I missing something obvious?

[Unseen Studios]

As noted in many posts, you were playing an encounter match, in which you face stacked decks to see how well your deck and skills stand up.

[Jools75]

Originally Posted by andsoitgoes

You've got to be kidding me. You really must.

Those games are worth, and deserve, to be paid full price. Some of them hurt me that they ever went in sale. Why, you ask? Because of that mentality. And it's a shame. It's that mentality that is forcing the app store to cave in on itself.

But it's your loss. And it makes me hope they never put it on sale, for the very reason that it is worth every single penny. Go try and get it for that price on PSN or XBLA. That's the only comparison you can make, because not only is it as good as those versions, it's better. Far better. To be able to see the cards and text up close is enough to soar this beyond the other versions, but to control it by touch is unbelievable. I always hated trying to control it on the Xbox, the controller was so unintuitive where the touch screen is a dream. And on top of all of this, it runs perfectly on the iPad 1. Not so much as a hiccup.

So continue to not pay what the games are worth. I'm sorry to hear that, and I hope that this mentality isn't shared by enough people that it ruins the app store, at least not more than it's already been ruined.

I completely agree. 100%.

I have first 2 ipads, the PS3, the Xbox360, and for each consolle I have all of the two previous version of Magic. This Magic 2013 on ipad is really so much polished and enjoyable (damn, I wish to pick defenses or tap lands with a simple swipe o click like this version on my consolles!!!) that make me thinks the full unlock price is a complete bargain if compared to other releases prices.

[dancj]

Originally Posted by andsoitgoes

Because cheaper price does not necessarily equal more sales.

It practically always does - but that's not the point. My point is that some people have the opinion that even if the sales would increase the sales by so much that it would make them more profit they still shouldn't drop the price.

Originally Posted by andsoitgoes

Because why should developers compromise their pricing for the sake of people who don't want to pay more?

They should only do it if that's what makes more money. If that's the case then they should do it because it makes more money.

Originally Posted by andsoitgoes

Where does that ever work or happen?

In the app store all the time.

Originally Posted by andsoitgoes

to take a game that is of this caliber, or the caliber of other games I mentioned, and expect... Nay, demand they lower their price is something that seems to only fly in the minds of iOS gamers.

Good thing no-one's doing that here then.

Originally Posted by andsoitgoes

Yes, a high quality game with high production values and that has this much depth to it, or with Carcassonne, etc, many of the other board/card games on the app store deserves to be priced high.

There's that weird 'deserves to be priced high' concept. To me it makes much more sense to say the game 'deserves to make as much profit as possible - and carry the price which will achieve that'. For all I know it might already be at the perfect price for maximum profit, but keeping the price high at the expense of profit is just cutting off your nose to spite your face.

Originally Posted by andsoitgoes

Just because a product is digital doesn't mean that it is worth a dollar.

I agree.

Originally Posted by andsoitgoes

Sure, they might sell more at a dollar, or $5, but why should they?

As I said above - They should only do it if that's what makes more money. If that's the case then they should do it because it makes more money.

Originally Posted by andsoitgoes

It's digital price is $10. That's the cross platform price.

That's the only argument I've seen that makes sense. If they want to avoid undercutting the price on other platforms I can understand that.

Originally Posted by andsoitgoes

It may have cost less to put onto the app store, but are you even considering the effort they put in to port the game here, in the full way it operates on current gen consoles?

That's not really relevant. The price should be whatever makes them the most profit. The amount of profit they think they can make should determine whether they decide to put in the effort to port the game.

Originally Posted by andsoitgoes

Isn't that worth it? I think it is.

For many people yes. For me when there are so many high quality games that are either free or 69p then not at the current price.

Originally Posted by andsoitgoes

And it would create fragmentation and lots of consumer uproar to price the same game on a different platform a lower price when the price point is this low.

Possibly - and that could be a very sound reason why they should keep the price higher. That said I haven't been aware of any uproar over Lego Harry Potter and some other console games that have been ported to iOS at a much cheaper price.

Originally Posted by andsoitgoes

Dropping the price "just because" devalues the game. You cannot compare the price of this game to, say, Angry Birds, or loads of the other <$5 games. It just doesn't work like that.

Yeah I can. This game at $10 isn't going to make half the profit that Angry Birds has at $1. Admittedly it wouldn't at $1 either as it's too much of a niche game (though it is far superior).

I realise there's a lot to consider - especially with a game like MTG that has physical and other platform versions. WoC need to consider not only iOS sales, but also the impact - both positive an negative - that it could have on those other versions. For all I know the price might be too low, too high or just right. I'm just arguing against the "They shouldn't bring the price down because the game deserves to be more expensice" mentality that goes completely against any kind of sound business sense.

[dancj]

Originally Posted by Unseen Studios

Some gamers seem to think they are entitled to games that are free or are the cheapest $0.99 option.

Good thing I'm not saying that.

Originally Posted by Unseen Studios

Why should you be able to buy this pretty faithful and almost exact replication of a current console and PC game for less just because it is on a portable device?

I don't think I should. All I said was that I'm not going to pay that much for it. I paid £4 each for the Steam versions of the first two and I'd happily go that high for the iPad one.

Originally Posted by Unseen Studios

Magic is a very niche market, it simply does not appeal to a massive amount of gamers so why should it go for mass market prices?

A big part of what I'm saying seems to be getting ignored or not understood so I'll repeat it again:

They should only do it if that's what makes more money. If that's the case then they should do it because it makes more money.