These are my endgame, level X builds for a team of six, each built around a different weapon type: Minigun: Charger. Full Scouting tree, Massacre, Miniguns, Full Critical. Light Armor (any), Deathbringer Storm (Rare). I have the "Old Painless" Epic, but the rare is better. I may eventually manufacture a max-damage / high-accuracy minigun. Rocket Launcher: Charger. Full Scouting Tree, Massacre, Rockets, Full critical. Light Armor (any). Jericho Launcher. Sniper Rifle: Scout. Full Scouting and Support Trees. Sniper Rifle. Light armor (any), Ranger's Sniper. (I don't consider this weapon at all necessary or particularly useful for 98% of the game, since there's little point in a sniper build that isn't at least a level IX scout). I recommend using Assault rifles early game and Rocket Launchers from VI to IX if you're aiming for this. Shotgun Devastator. Full combat tree, full critical, two damage. Enhanced Reflex Suit, Deathrip Goremanger. Notes: cold blood is optional, but I've found it useful enough not to respec. Due to second chance, a min-accuracy manufactured shotgun would be better than Deathrip, but costs 150k more. Buy one or the other, but not both. Also, Terminator is probably the better class due to Hunker Down, but you don't start with one and it's a slight difference. Assault Rifle: Scout. Full scouting tree, 3/4 Support tree. Light armor (any), Ranger's Carbine. The last two talent points can be chosen from stims, meds, damage, crit. Hammers: Stalker. Full scouting tree, first three Survival, and then probably two points in resistance (only unit I have not maxed). This has been my most situational unit. I use heavy armor (Riveted Combat Suit), but I wonder if light armor would be worth it with the Enhanced Reflex suit and a total of 80% resistance. As for overall classes: Scouts and Chargers are the best, not counting the exploit. As for overall talents: All of them are good except for Vengeance, which is pretty much a waste on any difficulty (again, not counting the exploit). As for overall weapons: Shotguns are probably the most useful weapon in the game, but by a very slight margin. Assault rifles are consistent and have great range (great for guard), but relatively poor for damage output in the second half of the game. Rocket Launchers are fantastic once you hit level VI. Sniper Rifles are mostly irrelevant. Miniguns with high damage are good (accuracy / critical stats for the weapon itself are irrelevant, so there are a lot of junk options to wade through). I've found Plasma Rifles to be grossly inferior to the others. Flamethrowers are for those who obsess over accuracy - only good if you have the legendary or a good epic like Scorcher.
Here are my thoughts on talents and individual skills: Scouting is the best talent-tree, hands down. The only top-tier build that doens't use it is a Shotgunner, and that's because Second Chance and boosted critical are both too good to spare the 4 talent points on Scouting. As for individual skills: improved metabolism is likely the best skill in the game (+1AP), particularly because it allows for extra positioning for heavy weapons, as well as extra shots while on guard. Fleet-foot is also one of the best skills in the game, though it only gives you unexpected opportunities for the most part, rather than more calculating tactics. Recon allows you to come out of the gate, weapons blazing. For many missions, you can take advantage of all 8 action points and break the back of the initial resistance. Lastly I think Sprint is underrated in this thread. It can be very useful both for getting into a good position a turn faster and for pulling out of a bad situation (though good play minimizes the need for this). Combat is underrated in this thread. Second Chance is one of the best skills in the game, if only for what it does for Shotguns (arguably turning them into the best weapon in Hunters 2). Massacre is better than it first appears. The obvious uses are Miniguns and Rocket Launchers on groups of 4-7 targets (yes, I have seen seven targets in range for Massacre on randomized missions, and four or five is not terribly uncommon. Three is a given). You save few AP with a shotgun, but it's also likely that you kill everything you hit. However, the real benefit of Massacre is at the strategic level, not the tactical level, and is poorly captured if "AP saved" is your only metric. Massacre allows you break the back of an entire scenario - essentially gut-punching the entire opposing force. It's not the action points that matter as much as the speed with which you kill large numbers of foes, putting the enemy at a material disadvantage. I think it would be reasonable for Massacre to be two-use intstead of one, but it's quite good as it is. The weak skills in the combat tree are cold blood and especially cripple shot. Cold blood provides unexpected opportunities like fleet-foot, but fewer of them. Cripple shot is mostly worthless because the game isn't built around slowly wearing down enemies. If you see them, you kill them. If you don't kill them, they better be at long range. When is cripple shot going to make a difference? Almost never - the main exception is the final boss and his guardians, but that level is a breeze in the first place. Survival is good but only great if you're using the exploit. Hunker down can be useful if you get yourself into trouble, but if you're playing well you rarely need it. It can be used as a defensive corrollary to Massacre (wade in with guns blazing, hunker down, then finish off enemies next turn). Last Stand is very weak outside of the exploit - when is it ever going to make a real difference in the outcome? Juggernaught is mostly worthless unless you're going for a build with 80-100% resistance, but doing so means you won't have Improved Metabolism, which is a significant opportunity cost. Regenerative Armor is almost entirely worthless - Hunters 2 is not a game of attrition. Mostly, you kill or be killed. Support is particularly good for an Assault Rifle build, and most teams will want one of those. The weapon's range and consistency make it ideal for guard, and support greatly enhances guard. Stand firm is by far the best skill in this tree (note: snipers benefit the most, but snipers themselves are not terribly relevant because they require 8 talent points just to get started). Sentry is OK, but I'd like to know what the actual boost to accuracy is. Steadfast is very weak, and will only make a difference in less than 1/5 missions, and a small one at that. Free fire is also very weak - it doesn't trigger very often and when it does, it's not likely to make any difference. Stand Firm and Sentry make this a worthwhile build for the Assault Rifle, and the whole tree is useful for Snipers. Vengeance is basically synonymous with the sadism/LastStand exploit. As I've said above, Hunters 2 is not a game of attrition, so a skill-tree based on taking damage but not dying is extremely questionable, even on normal difficulty. The only use I've found for this tree is against the final boss. If another squad-mate is wielding Rocket Launchers, you can manipulate Retribution and Revenge (splash damage) to deal 12-15k damage to the boss on your next hit. But what's the point? There's no rush and it's fun to kill all or most of the Amndyne soldiers that teleport in while you wear down the Guardian. Hardly worth leveling a character for. My Top 5 Talents: 1. Improved Metabolism 2. Second Chance 3. Fleet Foot 4. Massacre 5. Stand Firm Recon and Hunker Down are also notewothy. Sprint is decent. Everything else I could do without. It should be noted that ranking the talents across classes is not a terribly valid enterprise to begin with. For instance, I would not want a team without an Assault Rifle build, and I would not want an Assault Rifle build without Stand Firm, so it doens't really matter that I think Massacre and Second Chance are "better" overall.
Half your team using weapons that cost at least 2AP to fire!? I wouldn't even dare to think of such a team lineup . I don't like having team members lagging behind the pack. Minigun feels like a very big rifle for me, with the disadvantage of costing 1 skill point to equip. The trade of mobility and range doesn't quite justify its power imo. Your build seems to compliment the mobility issues but I wouldn't want to risk situations where I'm left in an open field out of AP. The rocket launcher doesn't get any love from me. It's got great range but 3 AP to fire severely limits the mobility of my team. Plus, I like ambushing enemies in doorways/corners with shotguns etc and the RL's splash damage does more collateral than good. I prefer snipers over the RL. Insane single target damage and best range of all weapons. Great for long distance firefights and can still do pot shots in fields with good cover. Pair this with second chance and it works like high-powered shotguns for long range. Shotguns are awesome in this game. Nuff said. Everyone team needs a high powered shotgun with second chance. Assault rifles are the attrition weapons I use. Pot shot, duck, ambush. Works (almost) everytime. A bit weaker than the minigun but the extra mobility more than makes up for it. I used to hammers like OHKO shotguns, but I stopped after realizing that shotguns are better than hammers in almost every situation I can think of, including point-blank encounters in doorways/corners. Hammers are just too risky even for glass cannon scouts with full scout and combat trees. ----------------------- My usual team is drawn from a pool of hunters: 1x shotgun Stalker w/ full scout tree and from 3 Survival, the rest can go anywhere. A high accuracy shotgun and 60% armor resistance makes him fill godlike, until the enemy crits . He's function mirrors the 'devastator' attack in Prototype - run into a pack of enemies (and spend the remaining AP), become a sitting duck (hunker or not), mop up . He's my 'safe' alternative for my other 2 Devastator builds. 1x plasma gun Terminator. Full Combat tree and 2 into Survival. The rest can go into anything (haven't decided yet). He's the ideal merge of the assault rifle and the sniper. Great mobility, and has the option of unleashing the highest burst damage in the game (I vaguely remember a 21k overcharge crit) at the cost of range. 1x flamethrower Scout. Full scouting tree and 3 Support, the rest into crit. This dood is a beast. Higher damage than assault rifles, great mobility to compensate for the loss of range, and support skills makes him the ideal candidate for 'bite and hold' tactic. High crit flamer is very underrated imo. 2x shotgun Devastator, same build as yours except 1 point in Retribution. Their purpose is usually room breaching (after Stalker or a scout have scouted the room), defense (surprisingly useful) or shock and awe (esp after taking damage. The last tactic is reserved for long distance room breaches, where AP would be low after the travel and a single high-powered attack is needed to take out hostiles. 2x minigun + shotgun (but both snipers to be) Arbiters. 3 Guard skills and full Vengeance tree. To be replaced by the sniper once I level him up. The only reason I'm using a minigun is because he has not got the points for a functional sniper build and the orange Azrael's Wrath is sexy (but still manages to disappoint). 3x assault rifle Zealots named after Hellsing/Dracula characters. Original concept design was to have full Survival to make them durable and Vengeance to deal MASSIVE damage to attackers. Remember my devastator attack earlier? That was originally drafted for the Last Stand + Revenge + Retribution + Counter Attack combo. Run these guns into mobs and have them act as virtual suicide bombs. Until I realized the near invincible Last Stand + Sadistic exploit. This was my response to rooms/open areas littered with enemies and stranded of AP. Let them hit me and these little Zealots would clear the area for the team. Now they just take the back seat and take pot shots. Sigh...
Of course, it varies by mission, but the "core" of the team are the non-sniper ranged fighters. The Sniper and Hammer Guy only come along if there's room. Also, I didn't even have a Sniper until three of my squad had reached level X. One of my Scouts was using the Jericho Launcher from Level VI onward, and after receiving the Legendary Sniper rifle for completing the campaign a fourth time, I respeced him. In my whole time playing this game, I can only think of one or two situations where a visible target was out of range for a Rocket Launcher. With splash damage and a 45% critical chance (Jericho +30), I was frequently doing 5200 to the primary target. The rocket scout routinely earned the most experience, even edging out the Devastator. However, early in the game, he fell behind (I was experimenting with plasma rifles with disappointing results), so my Devastator and Minigun-Charger reached level X first. Miniguns aren't quite as good as I'd hoped, but they're strong nonetheless. Deathbringer Storm routinely outperforms the Ranger's Carbine assault rifle for sheer damage, though the Charger does have decreased mobility. Results depend on whether you get "sustained" bursts. A single burst is disappointing, but a double is quite good (kills most non-heavy targets) and I've seen my Minigunner take out a Heavily Armored target (the ones with 6000+ HP) in one burst on numerous occasions. There's really no situation that my Minigun/AR/Rocket/Shotgun team can't handle. You do have to be strategic about where you use a Rocket Launcher. It's not good in small enclosed spaces, but the Shotgun isn't good in big open spaces either so you use the two to complement each other.
Thanks for all the tips guys! It was very helpful. What do you guys think of a Charger sniper? Combat to Second Change then Full Scouting for an offensive minded sniper, who jumps out, shoots or Massacre, second chance if he misses, and jumps back into hiding. Also what extra percent damage does a critical hit do? Is it 100% extra or more or less?
I've been playing for a couple of weeks and developed a somewhat of a "cheat" strategy for the last mission that seems to work well. I didn't see it mentioned on here, so I thought I'd share it. Spoiler Spoiler If you only open the left door and don't allow the boss to see you, then you fight all the hammer guys first without triggering the boss. It does take a little shuffling of your hunters, but then you can just fight the boss by himself.
Charger Sniper for a more aggressive approach is probably about as good as Scout Sniper for a more defensive one. Massacre/Second Chance does sound amusing with a Sniper Rifle - but you need a good one without the accuracy boost from Support and full AP. @Davegobe. That's pretty funny. I always open one door just to get half my team in position behind the right pillar so that, on turn two, I have full AP to attack the boss when he sees me. Still I wouldn't say it's abusive as much as it is entertaining - the final level is fun, but hardly difficult.
It seems like Rodeo has already moved on to their next big game (licensed, apparently), but a little love would go a long way toward smoothing out some rough edges in Hunters 2 and making it an evergreen title for TBS fans. Some A/V bugs: music, but not sfx, occasionally cuts out midway through a mission. This is mostly cosmetic, I admit. However, the same also happens with visuals, forcing you to abort the mission and lose your progress. I've had this happen roughly five times on my third gen iPad... so a little less than 10% of the time. Thankfully, it's never happened very far into the mission. Combat bugs: 1. As previously noted in this thread, Rocket Splash damage does not register under fog of war. It's a little annoying to blast a heavily armored target with two or three rockets, kill him, and have two new enemies revealed right behind him at full health. Splash damage from exploding enemies will register under fog of war, and this should too. 2. Miniguns cannot get a "sustained" result if fired on guard. Not bugs, but nitpicks of presentation: 1. Why are talents on the left side of the talent screen explicit (i.e., +10/20/30 critical), but talents on the right side of the screen are vague (i.e., "a chance" - Cold Blood, Cripple Shot, Fleet Foot, Sentry, etc). 2. Why on earth does reaching level X remove your end of mission stats? 3. Can't fire hunters (flogging a dead horse here). 4. Daily missions aren't randomly generated. I've seen at least 10 exact duplicates at this point, and I'm nearing the point where more than half of each new set are repeats. I'm pretty sure there is pool of predefined missions that are made available in random batches of five. If that's true, why give us repeats at all until we've seen all of the content at least once?
How are folks feeling about the level cap? I like the current cap of 10 because it forces you to make very careful choices with your nine talent points. The higher the cap, the less difficult (and mutually exclusive) the choices become. That said, I'd favor a level cap increase to XII. I still think the leveling progression loses way too much momentum after level VI, though, so maybe an increase in the cap wouldn't matter if its going to take 600-700k per additional level.
They already gave up on this game? I shouldn't be surprised after doing it to the first, yet for some reason I am! These games are really good in essence, with some TLC and a multiplayer it would be a top ranked game no problem at all. I guess it's all about the licensing now.
@temozarela 'Offensive minded sniper'? That kinda defeats the purpose of sniping from afar... The shoot and duck tactic is always useful though. Nevertheless, Scouting and Combat works well together for a variety of weapons. You can't go (too) wrong with the combination. Just remember that he's a glass cannon with emphasis on the glass. @JohnRayJr Dunno if it's part of the game or not. Counterattack would've made a full Survival and heavy armor minigunner pretty OP if you put him on guard. Don't mind the grind at all. Think it's to prevent your hunters from out-levelling loot and gear. More daily mission variety would be nice.
100% Resistance = immortal ? I've been thinking: You can get armor with up to 50% resistance from the trade. Add 30% resistance from the skills, +15% from Survival, leaves you with 95% resistance. I miss a Readme or Wiki about the functionality of Resistance. How much damage is a resisted shot?
When resistance triggers, you take 20% of normal damage. On hard, that often means 200-300 instead of 1000-1500. So not immortal, but pretty darn hard to kill. I'm not sure how much you could abuse it. Leaving yourself open to attack from 1 or two enemies could still mean a half dozen attacks, and that will come close to killing an squadmate in light armor. Maybe with Regenerative armor you could be a little reckless; I haven't tried it out myself. I'm not quite sure what I think of armor types in this game. The extra AP from light armor is really powerful. I'm not sure what would entice me to use medium or heavy armor.
Ah, thanks I am currently playing it on Normal, and it's really interesting to get to know the various aspects of different specs. I guess, it depends what kind of attacks you are trying to absorb? Hammer? Shotgun? RPG? You can always add 20% dodge to that, or 30% if you skip the regeneration, which would mean are pretty much unkillable. as for armor: I prefer light for the general public, and medium for mercs with the scout tree, who are prone to get caught in enemy fire. My hammer dude is wearing heavy armor though.
O_O OMG. Rodeo Games just announced their offical partnership with Games Workshop and their next game.... WARHAMMER FANTASY!!!! http://t.co/077S2DHm Drooling over the screenshots....
*Equips the entire roster with hammers* WARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!! Guess the assault rifle will be replaced by the Bolter .
Article on the front page today that Rodeo is make Warhammer Quest, due to arrive next Spring. Looking forward to it - never played it before, but it sounds cool on boardgamegeek.com!
Good info guys but I had a couple of questions. What % extra damages does a critical hit get a hunter? What is generally better for armor, resistance or more armor? Also is there a site that list all the rare armor and weapons that are sold? I want to buy some light armor, and a shotgun but I don't know all the stats to get the right one. Lastly are custom weapons or armor superior to the premade rare ones from the store?
Just wanted to say that, over 70 hours later, Hunters 2 is still my to go game...well always. I like to sink in one game only and complete it before buying the next and yes, I bought and completed other games last weeks (Horn, Puzzle Craft, in the middle of Supermagical now) but Hunters 2 is still my to go game for the daily contracts which continue to surprise me. I completed the campaign 3 times but I just do not feel the urge to have the legendary items...I forge them in the armory (genius!). As much as I can't wait for Warhammer Quest I wish they did some additional campaigns to play. My GOTY so far, and one of the best games I ever played. For some reason, everything in this game click with me...from sound to graphics to rules to ... well everything.
Really bad. Games like that need a save system that let you play when and where you want. I hope you revise your bad choice.
