Wow. Just wow. I'm speechless. All I'm gonna say is this is by far The most ridiculous post I've ever read on toucharcade. I regret wasting my time on this. You won't understand this simple logic even if someone puts a gun to your head.
At the end of the day, we all have our own opinions. I'm not saying it is wrong that you put value on devs support universal games and equal pricing between ipad and iphone, but I think most people here will say we like to support the devs that put out good game, regardless of what minor pricing differences changes they make.
I agree with this statement. I think Gabrien's point though was that if they could make the lite version universal, they could easily have made the hd version universal....(which I'm surprised IMNS didn't figured out. I thought moderators were private eyes for their day job #kidding)
I was initially taken aback that he couldn't figure that out as well. I think my mistake was working from the presumption that his integrity required no questioning. Having gone back to the beginning of this thread though and read through the first 40 or so pages, I think I am beginning to understand what's going on here: it appears to be a "boys' club" where Hodapp, IMNS, and co, as well as their various asskissers and lackeys single out targets for their amusement. Apparently I am their latest one. Only an assumption on my part of course, but an educated one none the less. I'm sure they'll continue to play dumb, feign amazement, and accuse me of paranoia, conspiracy theories, and so on. I'm done with participating in this ridiculous and even cruel farce. Only thing I suggest, for the benefit of those reading this thread who are truly unbiased: go read it from the start and make up your own minds.
In regards to Mad Wheels I think Gabrien had a valid point. It was odd that the lite version was universal but there was no universal paid version only two paid separate versions. (iPhone/iPad). I am not sure I have seen that happen before.
Lol, you've finally caught on then. That's the sole reason why this thread exists. It's because people decide to argue back that this thread has grown to be so large and popular. This place is a trash can; that's all.
Ding ding ding. I guess i could be considered one of their previous "targets" so I can confirm that u hit the nail right on the head. You are dealing with people (hodapp, IMNS) who moderate and contribute to the website so you aren't going to get unbiased opinion or really anything of substance for that matter. Their livelihood is apparently at stake. Although, hodapp serves his purpose by consolidating and ass kissing the wednesday night releases (and should be commended for his attempts at wit) and IMNS...well, I am sure he is just swell.
What a slap in the devs faces. Cheapskates and morality simply don't fit together and these accusations are just ridiculous.
I guess no one read my wall of text. I never said gabrien's wish of universal apps was wrong. Only thing I explained was its not that simple to 'sell' a universal app. It's not financially a viable option. Please waste 5 min and read that post before accusing me that I hadn't figured out that they could have easily made this a universal app, or that I am singling out someone for my own amusement. What gabrien is doing is the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen here (sorry natedogg, you aren't the most clueless person on the forums anymore). Calling devs manipulative, dishonest and unscrupulous just coz they are splitting the app into two lower prices versions instead of a costlier universal version? Jeez, what the hell is wrong with you? Also, I'm not surprised gab that you read through 400 posts and still have no frigging idea what happened in this thread. Clueless again.
I wonder why no-one blamed Apple yet - for charging a few hundred bucks for a shitty, slow, small device while you can get a fast high-class PC or notebook for the same amount? Wait... forgot fanboyism. But just don't listen to these people. Being so cheap, they are the dishonest and greedy ones. I guess they're getting all the apps "in various cheaper ways" anyway.
Didn't you say you were leaving these forums for good or something to that extent? Yeah, you were getting ganged up on because your argument that "devs pricing should never be questioned" blew up right in your face. You folded like a cheap suit. great to have you back!
As a wannabe dev who has just had to go through decisions regarding universal apps and pricing and whatnot, I thought I'd add a couple of cents. In my, admittedly limited experience, the move from SD to HD artwork increases the cost of development geometrically instead of linearly. When we were deciding on whether to go SD or HD, we had to look at the fact that SD technically works on all iDevices, but is not optimized for the latest generations of iPhone/iPod Touch or iPads. Put another way, if you go HD, you also have to do SD. From a business perspective this felt, to me at least, like they were two different products. One with a significantly higher cost. Now, that being said, there is also the consideration of just how many consumers will benefit from a universal version. There is a huge information gap here since I don't know of anywhere that has tried to peg just how many households have both iPads and iPhones/iPod Touches that are used by the same people. For me, my line of thinking was that people with both iPads and iPhones probably are a minority of iDevice owners. If making an app universal only benefits a handful of people, then it doesn't make a lot of business sense to go out of your way to do that. If you conclude that the majority of consumers have either an iPhone/iPod Touch or an iPad then it makes sense to split what is essentially two distinct products into two distinct products. I know that from a player's perspective the design and mechanics of a game usually is what distinguishes it. But from a dev perspective (and from a cost perspective) it's everything else that makes the versions distinct. For TEoR we've decided to only make an SD version for now, and should we make enough from the SD version we will update it to universal HD (perhaps with a price increase at that time not sure yet). I still feel that iPhone/iPod Touch and iPads are two distinct markets and that universality only benefits a handful of people. But with the number of iDevice users out there, Apple's handfuls seem a little larger than most companies so universality is definitely something to consider when developing an App. If I had Gameloft's brand cache and resources I would make more expensive universal titles. Since I don't, I'll make the best decision I can with the horrible information I have that will get my product to as many satisfied customers as possible. I think that's the thought process of most small devs, and I truly do not believe that charging two different prices for two different products is an incorrect decision to make.
Basically, assume that every single iOS household with children will fall into this category. For example, you've got me, my wife, and our two kids, all using iOS devices at this point and everything tied to one Apple ID. Your logic only applies if you assume everybody has their own personal Apple ID, which would apply to exactly zero of the iOS using people in my peers since we're all grown adults with college educations, children, and allegedly disposable income. Everybody has a family Apple ID that everyone in their household uses. I don't know if the numbers make sense to only do a universal, but the numbers can't makes sense to do an iPod/touch version and an iPad only version. By all means, keep splitting the difference if you think having a $1/$2 iPhone/touch version next to the $3-$5 universal is in your interest, but if you are going to do the HD iPad supporting version then I would strongly suggest it makes more economic sense to do it as a universal than an iPad only.
Surely the bottom line here is there is no one correct answer and it's up to developers to come up with their own business plans. Sometimes you'll like it, other times you won't. If you don't, feel free to voice your opinion politely then shut the hell up and get on with your life.
This is precisely the information gap I was talking about. My peers and I are all grown adults with college educations and no children (we're all DINKs). We all mostly have two Apple IDs in each household with a lot of people only having an iPhone/iPod Touch. But you're absolutely correct about families, which I admittedly don't have the most experience with. If you don't mind me asking, what age range are your kids. I feel that it would be different for households with teenagers rather than younger children, but I might be wrong. For me personally, everything I make will be universal since I seem to have every Apple device to have come out since I started working full time. But I think apart from my fanboyism, there are a lot more considerations. The above reminds me that if I'm making a family-oriented game there are definite benefits to making it universal. I just want to reiterate that economic sense is something that can only be made with a lot more information than we have about iDevice users. Right now we're just sort of fumbling around in the dark.
I've had many sleepless nights praying for the return of natedogg in this thread. Thank you, glorious god, wherever you are, for answering.
