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  #9711  
Old 11-23-2012, 05:21 PM
JediKnight JediKnight is offline
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You see I get the point that they are using your IP address, but isn't that how the other apps do it to? And aren't they under the location settings? Are they doing it without permission or do they just need it or or...
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  #9712  
Old 11-23-2012, 06:50 PM
undead.exe undead.exe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JediKnight View Post
You see I get the point that they are using your IP address, but isn't that how the other apps do it to? And aren't they under the location settings? Are they doing it without permission or do they just need it or or...
I'm under the impression that "Location Settings" is usually a request to pinpoint your exact location using something similar to GPS signals. That allows an application to determine where you are globally to within a 10-20 metre diameter, which is MUCH more extreme than the sort of location an IP address would give away -- IP addresses can at most determine what suburb you're in (and they're usually a few suburbs off because your ISP can assign you IP addresses which are geographically registered to a few different areas).

Any app that asks you for permission to use your location is probably asking whether you are comfortable with them triangulating and pinpointing a near-exact global position of where you are, which is why a lot of apps stress whether they keep personal information. I wouldn't be surprised if Location Settings actually uses your IP as a piece of information to help narrow down the area that needs to be scanned to pinpoint your location, but the IP address alone isn't enough to do it.

What an IP address DOES give away, as Sheinfell said above, is the location of your service provider. That alone is plenty more than enough to determine what continent you're in, although I imagine you might even have trouble using an IP to determine what country someone is in when it comes to countries which share borders and are otherwise very close together (Europe and the various states of America come to mind)

I'd also imagine that it would be somewhat illogical for an app to ask you whether it's allowed to access information about your IP address -- because to do so seems like it'd be the same as asking whether you're alright with the app accessing the internet, seeing how the IP address is a key piece of information needed for computers and networks to communicate. It makes more sense to ask that on a computer because people don't always want internet access, but it seems to be taken for granted that apps for smartphones and tablets were made for the internet.

Last edited by undead.exe; 11-23-2012 at 06:54 PM..
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  #9713  
Old 11-23-2012, 07:15 PM
JediKnight JediKnight is offline
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Originally Posted by undead.exe View Post
I'm under the impression that "Location Settings" is usually a request to pinpoint your exact location using something similar to GPS signals. That allows an application to determine where you are globally to within a 10-20 metre diameter, which is MUCH more extreme than the sort of location an IP address would give away -- IP addresses can at most determine what suburb you're in (and they're usually a few suburbs off because your ISP can assign you IP addresses which are geographically registered to a few different areas).

Any app that asks you for permission to use your location is probably asking whether you are comfortable with them triangulating and pinpointing a near-exact global position of where you are, which is why a lot of apps stress whether they keep personal information. I wouldn't be surprised if Location Settings actually uses your IP as a piece of information to help narrow down the area that needs to be scanned to pinpoint your location, but the IP address alone isn't enough to do it.

What an IP address DOES give away, as Sheinfell said above, is the location of your service provider. That alone is plenty more than enough to determine what continent you're in, although I imagine you might even have trouble using an IP to determine what country someone is in when it comes to countries which share borders and are otherwise very close together (Europe and the various states of America come to mind)

I'd also imagine that it would be somewhat illogical for an app to ask you whether it's allowed to access information about your IP address -- because to do so seems like it'd be the same as asking whether you're alright with the app accessing the internet, seeing how the IP address is a key piece of information needed for computers and networks to communicate. It makes more sense to ask that on a computer because people don't always want internet access, but it seems to be taken for granted that apps for smartphones and tablets were made for the internet.
but that technically would be "General location" which is what location services is doing...
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  #9714  
Old 11-23-2012, 08:15 PM
undead.exe undead.exe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JediKnight View Post
but that technically would be "General location" which is what location services is doing...
http://whatismyipaddress.com/

Try that site for example -- everything it's telling you is based on what your current IP address is.

Whether they're technically determining your "general location" or not is ultimately irrelevant, because Star Warfare isn't asking your device for permission to determine your location using its GPS capabilities (i.e. the "Location Services" function). Because it's using a piece of information that's freely available and necessary to connect to the internet (to play online), it wouldn't ever have to ask you for permission to use Location Services for the GPS function -- therefore, the "Location Services" function and permissions can't be related to the player segregation (which still seems to exist regardless of whether any of this is right or not, because as I've said before, none of us have ever been able to play with Fro5tClown or Arrow0x despite trying numerous times).

Basically, don't get hung up on the idea that an application MUST appear in the "Location Services" tab in order to determine any information at all pertaining to where you might be on a national level -- as you saw with that website above, it can make some wild guesses as to where you are, and it can do that on Safari on your iDevice as well while location services is disabled for Safari.

Last edited by undead.exe; 11-23-2012 at 08:20 PM..
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  #9715  
Old 11-24-2012, 03:14 AM
Sheinfell Sheinfell is offline
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Geez folks, is reading really going out of style with you young ones?

Under "location services" it clearly says it uses open ("crowd-sourced") wireless hotspots (Best example would be free wireless in an airport) to try and determine your location.
Note that I have an iPad without UMTS.

I'd have to doublecheck on what exactly it says on my girlfriend's iPhone, but I am quite sure that she has an additional switch for GPS-based locating.

VPN would actually be the easiest solution (go and read up on what that is exactly ).
In short, it opens a secure connection to a VPN gateway somewhere else, and then also gives you an IP address of that router's IP range.
E.g. in my last company, one of our VPN gateways was US-based, so stuff like Google advertisement thought I am in the US whenever I connected to it.
Downside is that mostly companies use this, to allow employees a secure connection to the company network. But there are free VPN programs as well, so we could set one up and allow e.g. Arrow0x to connect to it.
Of course, you get a higher latency, which might affect your playing experience.

I just read up on how Firefox does location-based stuff:
They use Google Location Services to try and pinpoint your location, look here:
http://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/geolocation/

arrow0x and others who are interested:
You could give anonymizer.com, TOR, or any other related service a try, see if those give you an IP from another location. Of course, the caveat about latency applies here as well.

If I find my notes again what I found for watching Syfy channel, I will let you know.
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  #9716  
Old 11-24-2012, 05:39 AM
undead.exe undead.exe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheinfell View Post
I'd have to doublecheck on what exactly it says on my girlfriend's iPhone, but I am quite sure that she has an additional switch for GPS-based locating.
They might have changed it for different iOS versions, but I'm not seeing a separate switch for the GPS function now that I take a proper look under location services: it simply says the following under iOS 6:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Location Services Text
Location Services using GPS along with crowd-sourced Wi-Fi hotspot and mobile phone mast locations to determine your approximate location.
I'm trying to locate a free VPN network based in China or Asia right now to see if the IP-address theory can be tested from this side. Going to need to refine my searches a bit though, because I keep stumbling into paid VPN networks (and possibly because people are usually trying to find things to get OUT of China rather than into it, I suppose)
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  #9717  
Old 11-24-2012, 08:19 AM
Sheinfell Sheinfell is offline
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Something completely different:
I just read that Baldur's Gate for the iPad is scheduled for 28th November.
Now, that's one damn nice birthday present for me

Put that on your radar, guys!
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  #9718  
Old 11-24-2012, 10:05 AM
undead.exe undead.exe is offline
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I'll have to take a look at that when I'm back from camp, thanks Sheinfell :P

--------

Think I found a free US-based VPN which SEEMS to work, though I don't know about its relative internet speed. If anyone from Asia is willing to try them out to see if that helps them get past the player segregation, please let us know if we can help, or how it goes

USVPN "New Free" -- scroll down and look for the instructions for either the iPhone, iPod or iPad. Where it's telling you to enter a username and password, you can find them on the homepage of that site (i.e. scroll to the top of the page and click "home", you'll find all the details you need just under the "Welcome" banner).

For players in Asia who are able to use this, there are basically two ways to confirm whether this method can break the geographical segregation: you're looking to either be able to play with people from outside of Asia, or you're looking to be UNABLE to play with friends within Asia (since you should now have a U.S-based IP address when you're connected to the VPN).

Arrow0x, Fro5tClown and ExactPsience, if any of you guys read this, please consider giving it a shot if you don't find it too troublesome

------------

Update: okay, that VPN seems to work properly when I'm using it to access websites, but I'm getting a lot of "can't access server" errors when I'm trying to run the game. Going to try using a different VPN to see if the results are any better...

Update 2: that's three supposedly different US-based VPNs I've just tried which seem to work for surfing the net via browsers, but end up giving me a "cannot connect to server" error from Star Warfare itself. Hmm...I get the impression we're on the right track though...

Last edited by undead.exe; 11-24-2012 at 10:41 AM..
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  #9719  
Old 11-24-2012, 12:13 PM
Exact-Psience Exact-Psience is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by undead.exe View Post
I'll have to take a look at that when I'm back from camp, thanks Sheinfell :P

--------

Think I found a free US-based VPN which SEEMS to work, though I don't know about its relative internet speed. If anyone from Asia is willing to try them out to see if that helps them get past the player segregation, please let us know if we can help, or how it goes

USVPN "New Free" -- scroll down and look for the instructions for either the iPhone, iPod or iPad. Where it's telling you to enter a username and password, you can find them on the homepage of that site (i.e. scroll to the top of the page and click "home", you'll find all the details you need just under the "Welcome" banner).

For players in Asia who are able to use this, there are basically two ways to confirm whether this method can break the geographical segregation: you're looking to either be able to play with people from outside of Asia, or you're looking to be UNABLE to play with friends within Asia (since you should now have a U.S-based IP address when you're connected to the VPN).

Arrow0x, Fro5tClown and ExactPsience, if any of you guys read this, please consider giving it a shot if you don't find it too troublesome

------------

Update: okay, that VPN seems to work properly when I'm using it to access websites, but I'm getting a lot of "can't access server" errors when I'm trying to run the game. Going to try using a different VPN to see if the results are any better...

Update 2: that's three supposedly different US-based VPNs I've just tried which seem to work for surfing the net via browsers, but end up giving me a "cannot connect to server" error from Star Warfare itself. Hmm...I get the impression we're on the right track though...
Thanks, but i've pretty much quit star warfare. I've deleted my character already, and i wont be ready to grind again everything ive lost.

I hope this helps those who are currently playing the game which arent on the NA servers though.
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  #9720  
Old 11-24-2012, 12:43 PM
SuperionEXE SuperionEXE is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Exact-Psience View Post
Thanks, but i've pretty much quit star warfare. I've deleted my character already, and i wont be ready to grind again everything ive lost.

I hope this helps those who are currently playing the game which arent on the NA servers though.
Hey there, nice to see you again Psience, and yeah, that's the hope for now. It'll probably be what we'll be doing until we get a new PvE or Boss update in SW.
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