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  #1031  
Old 09-28-2012, 01:43 PM
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LordGek LordGek is offline
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Originally Posted by cplr View Post
I understand your point completely, but realize that the difficulty is the same for everyone. so if you are concerned about getting high scores because you are really good - you will still be really good compared to everyone else. your score might be higher than it is on a real table, but comparatively to everyone else, your place would be the same.
I also appreciate how, as a pinball enthusiast, it isn't that he wants to brag about his skills, he just wants a realistic as possible sim. That being said, I'm willing to bet, as marketeers always aim at the lowest common denominator, he isn't REALLY the key demographic this game is geared toward. Perhaps in the future they can add, maybe make unlockable, Pro-Modes of each table with just really subtle tweaks to physics, table angles, and the like that might make the game closer to the real thing EVEN IF it means the average player will drain in 5 seconds.
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  #1032  
Old 09-28-2012, 01:56 PM
sladeums sladeums is offline
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I can't speak for Rudi, but for me the concern is not about the (ultra) high scores, but rather the product is not what it is pitched as.

These guys endlessly drone on about how fanatical they are about replicating the real thing right in your home, but never with the caveat that the replication extends primarily to the table facade and features ... not truly a genuine simulation of the physical product (which they nonetheless purport to be).

Quotes from their KickStarters, emphasis mine :

Quote:
We want our videogame version to play exactly the same as the table played when it was new, so we start with a thorough restoration of the table.

We’ve created ROM-emulation technology that allows the same program which controlled the original table to run on our target devices. This means that every rule, sound effect, and light sequence is exactly correct in our digital version.

We’ve continuously improved our pinball physics engine for the last seven years and we’re very proud of it. We can individually control reflection angles and physics parameters for every section of any component on the playfield. We use the original table as reference when doing this to ensure accuracy.

The end result of this painstaking process is an exact digital recreation of the pinball table that you can play on your handheld device or in your living room.
It's always a disappointment to buy one of these tables and flip half to 4/5ths the table goals in the first game.

Despite all their ballyhoo over ROM-emulation and awesome lighting engines I still contend the older Hall of Fame collection plays (and looks) better than these new tables.

Still my biggest disappointment of the year.
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  #1033  
Old 09-28-2012, 02:45 PM
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LordGek LordGek is offline
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Originally Posted by sladeums View Post
I can't speak for Rudi, but for me the concern is not about the (ultra) high scores, but rather the product is not what it is pitched as.

These guys endlessly drone on about how fanatical they are about replicating the real thing right in your home, but never with the caveat that the replication extends primarily to the table facade and features ... not truly a genuine simulation of the physical product (which they nonetheless purport to be).

Quotes from their KickStarters, emphasis mine :



It's always a disappointment to buy one of these tables and flip half to 4/5ths the table goals in the first game.

Despite all their ballyhoo over ROM-emulation and awesome lighting engines I still contend the older Hall of Fame collection plays (and looks) better than these new tables.

Still my biggest disappointment of the year.
Could some of this be the limits of the lower end iOS systems they're trying to have this run optimally on? Like how do these same tables run on XBOX 360 or PS3?
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  #1034  
Old 09-28-2012, 02:49 PM
cplr cplr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LordGek View Post
Perhaps in the future they can add, maybe make unlockable, Pro-Modes of each table with just really subtle tweaks to physics, table angles, and the like that might make the game closer to the real thing EVEN IF it means the average player will drain in 5 seconds.
That is a fantastic idea. If you beat all the wizard goals, you unlock super-ultra-realistic-simulation mode. I like it.
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  #1035  
Old 09-28-2012, 03:09 PM
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LordGek LordGek is offline
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Originally Posted by cplr View Post
That is a fantastic idea. If you beat all the wizard goals, you unlock super-ultra-realistic-simulation mode. I like it.
Nice and out of the way plus the changes are likely to be pretty subtle without need for all new art assets or anything. They'd just be some subtle behind the curtain tweaks.
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  #1036  
Old 09-28-2012, 03:16 PM
famousringo famousringo is offline
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I think it's an exaggeration to call these tables unrealistic or a poor simulation just because they're easier. There are plenty of ways to adjust a real table to make it easier.

That being said, an unlockable pro mode is a good idea. Something for them to work on if they ever run out of other improvements to make (better graphics, physics, UI, etc.). But they should focus on improving the game for everybody first, and cater to the hardcore enthusiasts later.
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  #1037  
Old 09-28-2012, 03:45 PM
Rudi Rudi is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LordGek View Post
I also appreciate how, as a pinball enthusiast, it isn't that he wants to brag about his skills, he just wants a realistic as possible sim. That being said, I'm willing to bet, as marketeers always aim at the lowest common denominator, he isn't REALLY the key demographic this game is geared toward. Perhaps in the future they can add, maybe make unlockable, Pro-Modes of each table with just really subtle tweaks to physics, table angles, and the like that might make the game closer to the real thing EVEN IF it means the average player will drain in 5 seconds.
On a real table, a beginner played about 2 minutes with 3 balls. After practicing a while about 5-10 minutes. An experienced player 15 minutes or more. But never almost 60minutes like in pinball arcade.Thats not, how real pinball is.
Just make the flipper fingers a little bit shorter and it works. I've done that in visual pinball, when a table was to easy. Why dont they just let us choose at the start between normal and hard. Like in most other games.
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  #1038  
Old 09-28-2012, 03:50 PM
sladeums sladeums is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LordGek View Post
Could some of this be the limits of the lower end iOS systems they're trying to have this run optimally on? Like how do these same tables run on XBOX 360 or PS3?
No personal experience, so I cannot honestly say.

Comments from others have lead me to believe they are about the same as far as the (relatively) dumbed down difficulty.

Don't have a 360, but I was cautiously optimistic that the PS3 version would improve on the iOS version on some levels; but reports of lag issues (in HD res over 720) and the standard laundry list of bugs that seem to come with every update by these guys on every platform have led me to take a wait and see approach if and how any of this stuff ever gets taken care of.
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  #1039  
Old 09-28-2012, 06:35 PM
nafkert nafkert is offline
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For those complaining about re-downloading the tables, the reason that you have to re-download them is because they have been updated to take care of bug fixes and other things. You are actually getting updated tables.

For example, in black hole The gate in the lower playfield now stays open properly. There are also other multiball and sound fixes.
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  #1040  
Old 09-29-2012, 03:48 AM
killy billy killy billy is offline
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I'm not Number 1 on the worldwide leaderboard on any of the tables, so it's not "too easy" for me!

So i guess you are number 1 on every table rudi
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