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business of Apple is getting worse compared to previous a few years is a good thing?

12-17-2012, 09:20 PM
#11
Joined: May 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 6,714
Quote:
Originally Posted by squarezero View Post
It did get Google to upgrade the map experience on iOS, which they had refused to do till Apple gave them access to your personal information. In my book that's a big win for Apple.
That post (my own that you were responding to) was worded extremely poorly.

What I meant was that Apple has, for the past 20+ years, had the reputation of cranking out products that were very, very well polished and refined. The features just oozed quality and they were easy to use and almost always worked. Then came along Siri, which they admitted was still in beta/incomplete, yet they included it in the 4s. Not a big deal, but worth taking note of. Then the maps debacle comes along. They decide to completely buck off Google, Youtube, maps and all, and implement their own map system. People expected a polished product as usual, but it turned out to be buggy, often incorrect and a huge downgrade. That, in my opinion, really hurt the reputation that they've spent years building up. Just my 2 cents.

Now will it cause the death of a giant? Of course not. There is no viable alternative to the AppStore and iOS ecosystem. That is the lifeblood of iOS devices, and something no one can reasonably dispute.
12-17-2012, 10:00 PM
#12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Teknikal View Post
Not really Google offered them turn by turn before but only if they would put the Google name inside the app, Apple refused. Now Google have everything they originally wanted.

Maybe a win for both sides depending on how you look at it but I think Apple have really suffered a lot more for it.
You are incorrect. Google wanted a default data sharing set up and an default sign-up to your Google account. Google doesn't care whether their name appears on the app: what they want is the personal data, which is how they make money (by targeting advertising). Apple refused to do that under the Apple brand.

Now Apple has their cake and get to eat it, too: they preserve their user-protection brand position, and they get high-quality Google maps. When I downloaded the app and got the prompt to log in to my Google account, I knew exactly who is prying into my private life -- it sure wasn't Apple. I am also sure that Google is not getting other information from me like call logs.

12-17-2012, 10:02 PM
#13
Quote:
Originally Posted by JBRUU View Post
That post (my own that you were responding to) was worded extremely poorly.

What I meant was that Apple has, for the past 20+ years, had the reputation of cranking out products that were very, very well polished and refined. The features just oozed quality and they were easy to use and almost always worked. Then came along Siri, which they admitted was still in beta/incomplete, yet they included it in the 4s. Not a big deal, but worth taking note of. Then the maps debacle comes along. They decide to completely buck off Google, Youtube, maps and all, and implement their own map system. People expected a polished product as usual, but it turned out to be buggy, often incorrect and a huge downgrade. That, in my opinion, really hurt the reputation that they've spent years building up. Just my 2 cents.

Now will it cause the death of a giant? Of course not. There is no viable alternative to the AppStore and iOS ecosystem. That is the lifeblood of iOS devices, and something no one can reasonably dispute.
I don't disagree -- there's a reason why Apple fired the head of the map project.
12-17-2012, 10:54 PM
#14
Joined: Oct 2010
Location: Belfast N Ireland
Posts: 2,073
Quote:
Originally Posted by squarezero View Post
You are incorrect. Google wanted a default data sharing set up and an default sign-up to your Google account. Google doesn't care whether their name appears on the app: what they want is the personal data, which is how they make money (by targeting advertising). Apple refused to do that under the Apple brand.

Now Apple has their cake and get to eat it, too: they preserve their user-protection brand position, and they get high-quality Google maps. When I downloaded the app and got the prompt to log in to my Google account, I knew exactly who is prying into my private life -- it sure wasn't Apple. I am also sure that Google is not getting other information from me like call logs.
Well I do know Google collects data from cell towers, wifi access points etc but Apple does as well I believe it's to help with the skyhook style of gps, also I wasn't forced to sign in on the new maps app I just skipped that.

Apples paid a very heavy price in my opinion in both stock value and reputation, the whole thing could probably have been avoided pretty easy if they weren't determined to make Google an enemy.

Going to leave this thread alone now as it's bit of a danger topic.

I don't mean to sound bitter, cold, or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out
12-17-2012, 11:16 PM
#15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Teknikal View Post
Well I do know Google collects data from cell towers, wifi access points etc but Apple does as well I believe it's to help with the skyhook style of gps, also I wasn't forced to sign in on the new maps app I just skipped that.

Apples paid a very heavy price in my opinion in both stock value and reputation, the whole thing could probably have been avoided pretty easy if they weren't determined to make Google an enemy.

Going to leave this thread alone now as it's bit of a danger topic.
Google and Apple have different business model. Apple may collect data, but doesn't use it to target advertising. Their business is selling devices; their customers are the end users. Google makes money by selling advertising. Their customers are advertisers; their product is our data. I'm not saying that either company is more altruistic -- they're both in the business of making money and do so very, very well. Personally, I prefer to be the customer in a business relationship, rather than the product. Others are willing to sacrifice their privacy to get quality free services.

Considering their contrasting business models, it's not surprising that they would come to blows over the map app. Location -- knowing where we go and how we get there, is both valuable data, and a core piece of what we consider private information. You can't fault Apple for drawing the line there. Where they screwed up was in the implementation (which is also where their reputation took a hit). I don't think it was an issue of choosing to make Google an enemy; in any event, Google chose that path much earlier when they entered the mobile market.

BTW Not sure why you think this is a "danger topic."
12-18-2012, 12:45 PM
#16
Joined: Oct 2010
Location: Belfast N Ireland
Posts: 2,073
Quote:
Originally Posted by squarezero View Post

BTW Not sure why you think this is a "danger topic."
Ah only because I have a more negative view of Apple recently than most people on this forum and I'm trying to avoid annoying anyone to much, guess I've just read about one lawsuit to many.

Despite that though I'm still considering a new iPod if the dock situation for the new connector improves, I still find it useful for a few tasks and have a lot of apps I'll lose otherwise.

I don't mean to sound bitter, cold, or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out
12-18-2012, 03:38 PM
#17
Joined: Mar 2011
Location: Tel-Aviv
Posts: 2,299
SD card slot on all apple devices, pronto.

Doesn't really have that much to do with the topic of the thread, but couldn't hurt pointing that request out loud.

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12-18-2012, 05:59 PM
#18
Joined: Jan 2011
Location: Right behind you, with the machete raised
Posts: 269
Quote:
Originally Posted by EfratBarTal View Post
SD card slot on all apple devices, pronto.

Doesn't really have that much to do with the topic of the thread, but couldn't hurt pointing that request out loud.
I totally agree with that last point. The only reason for fixed space on iOS devices is for Apple to force consumers to spend the extra $100 on a memory upgrade.

In Soviet Russia, whenever anyone mentions Twilight, they are brutally PWNED by Simon Belmont... wait, that happens everywhere.