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iPhone: Any help solving Jabeh using logic please...?

01-29-2009, 05:38 AM
#1
Joined: Jul 2008
Location: Formerly Zimbabwe - now England.
Posts: 1,394
Any help solving Jabeh using logic please...?

I downloaded the game Jabeh awhile ago, and I started off on the Easy levels to begin with, just to get into it and to get a feeling for the game.

Having felt I'd suitably mastered the easy levels, I thought I'd switch the difficulty settings to "Any", which would now present me with a random choice of Easy, Medium or Hard each time I played a new game.

Ummm, OK, so maybe I'm not ready just yet... or maybe I just need something explained to me...

Now first of all, bear in mind, that I *DO* completely understand the concept of the game. I know what the arrows mean, column/row numbers, etc.
And I know the tips and tricks of first eliminating empty squares by crossing out the zero rows/columns and also by eliminating squares behind a horizontal or vertical arrow in a row or column with a 1 in it, etc. and then filling in the squares after that where there's only one possible position for the stone, etc.
And I've watched the developer's own tutorial video here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lc-nnRtEEh8
So I know all about that and how the game is played and what the rules are, etc.

Using all that logic, I have successfully cleared every single Easy board that I have played.
The problem comes though when I attempt to play a Medium or a Difficult board.
In the developer's own words (in an email to me), the puzzles in Jabeh "can all be solved using only logic", and that there is no guesswork involved.
I'm guessing another technique is called for, because the methods that work for the easy puzzles are (obviously) not enough to solve the harder puzzles.

OK, so with that in mind, can anyone tell me what the next step in either one of the two puzzles below is meant to be... easy or hard, take your pick...
To expand on that though, not only what the step is, but rather more importantly, what *logic* is involved in determining what that step is?
I really don't want to use the Hint button, and besides which, the Hint button doesn't actually give you a hint as such (if we're going by the correct definition of the word), it just places a stone on the board for you in the correct place, without telling you why that's the correct place so using the hint button won't actually help me solve future puzzles, if you know what I mean...

Any help please? Thanks in advance...


Website: www.NotHowItLooks.com Twitter: @BrettArchibald
Artwork, animation & UI-design for Beyond Ynth Parachute Panic Chicken Raid
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01-29-2009, 06:22 AM
#2
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 2,710
About the first: in the 3rd column there are 2 diagonal arrows... Using some logic you can discard more squares from the game...

I think you can use the same approach in the second (look at the 5th row: 2 diagonal arrows...).

iPhone 6 and iPad Mini iOS 8

01-29-2009, 06:49 AM
#3
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 25
I too love this game and had the same problem moving up to Medium and Hard. I got in touch with the developer and he kindly made another video of a Medium puzzle being solved.

http://jabeh.cachefly.net/MediumPuzzles.mov

Hope this helps
01-29-2009, 06:50 AM
#4
Joined: Jul 2008
Location: Formerly Zimbabwe - now England.
Posts: 1,394
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlos-Sz View Post
About the first: in the 3rd column there are 2 diagonal arrows... Using some logic you can discard more squares from the game...

I think you can use the same approach in the second (look at the 5th row: 2 diagonal arrows...).
I see them, but each of those arrows is pointing to *two* possible squares. It's not apparent (at least not to me) which of the two possible squares contains the stone.
So what's the logic that determines which of these squares does contain the stone and which does not?

I still need help, please...

As an aside, what would be nice in this game would be to have a third marker, that being a question-mark or something, so you can mark out *possible* squares.
I'm thinking along the lines of how you get a flag in MineSweeper or the mini corner pencil marks you can make in Sudoku...

Website: www.NotHowItLooks.com Twitter: @BrettArchibald
Artwork, animation & UI-design for Beyond Ynth Parachute Panic Chicken Raid
Multiple icon-sets design for Thingy Blox
01-29-2009, 06:57 AM
#5
Joined: Jul 2008
Location: Formerly Zimbabwe - now England.
Posts: 1,394
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlos-Sz View Post
About the first: in the 3rd column there are 2 diagonal arrows... Using some logic you can discard more squares from the game...

I think you can use the same approach in the second (look at the 5th row: 2 diagonal arrows...).
Actually, you know what, I think I solved it or I got the next step at least...

But I only "saw" the solution when I opened the screenshot up in Photoshop and started marking out potential squares with my own "possibility flag" symbol.
So yeah, personally speaking, I'd like to see a third "potential" marker added to the game.
I'll email the developer and see what he thinks of the idea...

Website: www.NotHowItLooks.com Twitter: @BrettArchibald
Artwork, animation & UI-design for Beyond Ynth Parachute Panic Chicken Raid
Multiple icon-sets design for Thingy Blox
01-29-2009, 07:05 AM
#6
Joined: Jul 2008
Location: Formerly Zimbabwe - now England.
Posts: 1,394
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moog View Post
I too love this game and had the same problem moving up to Medium and Hard. I got in touch with the developer and he kindly made another video of a Medium puzzle being solved.

http://jabeh.cachefly.net/MediumPuzzles.mov

Hope this helps
Aah great, thanks. I'll take a look at that now...

Update: I just watched the video, and it seems to make perfect sense when you're sitting back watching someone else do it — now I just have to see if I can do it myself later today.

Website: www.NotHowItLooks.com Twitter: @BrettArchibald
Artwork, animation & UI-design for Beyond Ynth Parachute Panic Chicken Raid
Multiple icon-sets design for Thingy Blox

Last edited by BrettArchibald; 01-29-2009 at 07:16 AM.
01-29-2009, 12:44 PM
#7
Joined: Sep 2008
Location: Colorado
Posts: 2,654
The medium puzzles usually require a guess and the hard usually require two or three. They can still be solved with logic, though. Sometimes you have to rule out a piece by trying it and seeing if it works.

You can do it without guessing, if you can think that far ahead. If you can visualize the next few moves after you would have made that guess, you can usually see if it would have worked or not. That's why they're considered hard. They take a lot of thought (or patience, depending which route you take).

In the easy levels, everything is pretty much spelled out for you.
01-29-2009, 12:57 PM
#8
Joined: Jul 2008
Location: Formerly Zimbabwe - now England.
Posts: 1,394
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotYou View Post
The medium puzzles usually require a guess and the hard usually require two or three...
I would dispute that, at least if you're playing the game "properly". The whole point of this game is that all the puzzles can be solved with logic only and *NO* guesswork.

In the words of the Jabeh-developer himself, when I asked him about the other similar game to this available on the App-Store:

Quote:
It's true that Shinro claims to have 4000, but many of them have multiple solutions so they're not actually valid puzzles. Additionally, the puzzles that are of medium and harder difficulty often require outright guessing (no logic involved). I have verified this, because I bought Shinro to test it out.

The Jabeh puzzles are hand made and can all be solved using only logic. Lots of them also have patterns made with their arrows to enhance the experience. Jabeh has 3 modes of puzzle difficulty (easy, medium and hard), and I'm also waiting for Apple to release the Lite version. I think you'll also find that the controls and user interface are vastly superior on Jabeh.

Website: www.NotHowItLooks.com Twitter: @BrettArchibald
Artwork, animation & UI-design for Beyond Ynth Parachute Panic Chicken Raid
Multiple icon-sets design for Thingy Blox
01-29-2009, 01:02 PM
#9
Joined: Sep 2008
Location: Colorado
Posts: 2,654
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrettArchibald View Post
I would dispute that, at least if you're playing the game "properly". The whole point of this game is that all the puzzles can be solved with logic only and *NO* guesswork.

In the words of the Jabeh-developer himself, when I asked him about the other similar game to this available on the App-Store:
In the second part of my post I explain that you can solve them without guessing. If you can't figure the puzzles out using logic, you can make one or two trial moves. If you can think ahead a few moves, you don't need to guess.
01-29-2009, 01:12 PM
#10
Joined: Jul 2008
Location: Formerly Zimbabwe - now England.
Posts: 1,394
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotYou View Post
In the second part of my post I explain that you can solve them without guessing. If you can't figure the puzzles out using logic, you can make one or two trial moves. If you can think ahead a few moves, you don't need to guess.
Sure, I get what you're saying, which is why I put the word "properly" in quotation marks there...
I wanted to learn the techniques for playing this game *without* using any guesswork.
I had actually solved one or two medium puzzles by guessing before I started this thread, but it just didn't feel very satisfactory somehow...

Website: www.NotHowItLooks.com Twitter: @BrettArchibald
Artwork, animation & UI-design for Beyond Ynth Parachute Panic Chicken Raid
Multiple icon-sets design for Thingy Blox