iPhone 3.0

Discussion in 'Public Game Developers Forum' started by danc4498, Mar 17, 2009.

  1. spawn12345

    spawn12345 Well-Known Member

    Jan 29, 2009
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    There is nothing that supports it. Why would they release a new now when they are coming with the big 3.0 update now?
    Then they could have skipped the update and just released a new phone. They said it themselfs they are into the software in the phones NOT the hardware like every other mobile manufacturer.
    The iphone 3g is still selling like mad and with the update it will sell even more.

    If you so sure on the rumors that have NO support whatsoever. Then shall we bet $100? Im up for it :cool:
     
  2. Zarile3

    Zarile3 Well-Known Member

    Dec 13, 2008
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    #82 Zarile3, Mar 17, 2009
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2009

    It's funny that Apple charges this though, seeing as Palm never did for any of there devices, it doesn't cost anything to update your psp, nor any other mobile device that isn't tied to a contract. Oh well, there IS a way to get around it, I never payed for any of my Itouch software upgrades.



    And to Spawn. I didn't say I was positive it they are going to release a new Iphone, all I'm saying is there isn't proof they are going too, and there isn't proof they aren't going too. I am just hoping they will.
     
  3. spiffyone

    spiffyone Well-Known Member

    Dec 7, 2008
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    Doesn't really matter, though, does it?

    Why?

    No bluetooth in the 1st gen touch. And the 1st gen touch is the "base" model. The smart developers, the ones that don't go all ga-ga over "innovation", but are fiscally intelligent understand that if one develops for the 1st gen touch in mind then one is assured the app will work on ALL the devices in the platform and thus assured of the largest possible pool of potential consumers to which to sell product.

    If one leaves out the 1st gen touch, and invests heavily in stuff like bluetooth compatibility for things like games, well, then you've probably screwed yourself over some. You've invested in something that not ALL the potential consumers can put to use. Putting the functionality in say, a game, isn't as bad as those silly devs that totally lock out the 1st gen touch (or both gens of the touch and release "iPhone only" apps), but it represents an investment in something that, y'know...not everyone will be able to use. In which case the question is do you want to spend more time and money as a dev doing that?
     
  4. danc4498

    danc4498 Well-Known Member

    Jan 15, 2009
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    Wow, so because Enron screwed over millions of people, iPod Touch users now have to buy their firmware updates?

    How about the Xbox 360? Microsoft offers lots of firmware updates with tons of new features for free.
     
  5. Danny-Doggy

    Danny-Doggy Active Member

    Feb 24, 2009
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    I wouldn't pay 99 cents for the last Sway update and if I knew that a games was going to charge for future updates/DLC I would not buy it.
     
  6. Zarile3

    Zarile3 Well-Known Member

    Dec 13, 2008
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    Yes they do, but your also paying for the service to begin with. Unless you consider Silver memberships, and in that case, who knows.
     
  7. #87 mrbass, Mar 17, 2009
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2009
    Very happy with SpotLight and Notes Sync since it'll backup your Notes. Search Mail is long overdue too. Also landscape eliminates lots of those apps appearing in top 100 no more voids to be filled. Honestly I was shocked at how much stuff they announced. Push notifications sounds pretty handy too.

    Pretty much eliminated need to jailbreak. Themes/icons whoopie do mine is prettier than yours...please go back home child to mama. Background apps ...ok very minor issue for radio apps. Quickgold ad-ridden is replaced with Spotlight. I just hope you can have say 300 apps and be able to delete an app not showing on one of the 9 app pages. So perhaps delete app within spotlight?

    So honestly I have not much left to complain about so I'll just nitpick one item:

    Microtransactions....I sure hope they have a universal setting to disable that which can be locked/unlocked hopefully in the parental controls section. They say free apps can't use microtransactions but how are they going to police an app comes out for $0.99 that has microtrans up the ying yang. Then it drops to free for a few weeks. So perhaps a new policy that ones you set your app to paid you can fluctuate price all you want but can never make it free? Hmmmm. Oh well as long as there is a universal option to disable microtransactions I'm cool with it.
     
  8. danc4498

    danc4498 Well-Known Member

    Jan 15, 2009
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    But you're forgetting that as time goes on, the ratio of 1st gen touch users to everone else, gets smaller and smaller. So at some point, it'll be better to implement new fancy features to pull in the majority of the potential customers rather than sacrificing quality for the good of the minority.
     
  9. Zarile3

    Zarile3 Well-Known Member

    Dec 13, 2008
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    But also think about it the other way. Say there are 15 million Ipod Touch 1st gen users. And say, 30 2nd gen users. I highly doubt ANY of those 15 million will ever want to upgrade to a 2nd gen, because why do it when all you get is bluetooth. I know I wouldn't upgrade mine unless it died on me. So say, 3 million convert to 2nd gen users. So we now have 12 million against 33 million. Do you really want to lose sales out of that 12 million? Possibly 1 million people buy your app at 2 dollars. That's a hell of a lot of money that you just lost because you wanted to integrate bluetooth.
     
  10. spiffyone

    spiffyone Well-Known Member

    Dec 7, 2008
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    The only big things I'm interested in as a 1st gen touch user, and really the only things I can really put to use anyway, are cut and paste, landscape keyboard, and the search function.

    And, really, when you get down to it...all 3 of those things should have been there from the get-go. It took Apple until a 3.0 software update to include cut and paste, landscape keyboard, and a search function for easier app picking and launching?

    Also, I hope that the spotlight/search function can be used as a way to solve the "9 page only" issue. From my understanding the search function would possibly allow for the finding of "hidden" apps on pages past 9 when all the pages have been filled and launch them even though they aren't visible otherwise.
     
  11. spiffyone

    spiffyone Well-Known Member

    Dec 7, 2008
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    The problem with that sort of thinking is that if you ignore the 1st gen users then you actually will be going against the idea of pulling in the majority of the potential consumers.

    How?

    Because even though the ratio of 1st gen touch users to everyone else gets smaller as time goes on, that part of the pool doesn't cease to exist, and their devices are still part of the overall platform. So if you develop a game or other sort of app for this platform, but ignore the 1st gen touch users, then you NEVER get a shot at the majority of users for the platform as a whole, because the platform as a whole includes all of the devices.

    Understand?

    Now, if you just implement the feature, but allow for the app to run on 1st gen devices without said feature it's a quite a bit different, but the issue of whether or not that investment is worth it is still questionable depending on the developer, their budget, and who they feel the target audience is with their app. And there's also the issue of developer time, effort, and money going to implement a feature that part of the audience will not be able to use. Perhaps that money and effort can instead be used to get it up and running as optimally as possible across all of the devices instead. So, again, it'll be questionable as to whether the investment cost is worth it, and it'll be up to individual devs to weigh their options accordingly. Sometimes it'll be worth it, and probably more often not really.
     
  12. The primary point of contention here is that, germane to Apple's portable devices, the firmware upgrades must contain significant enhancements that in and of themselves add material value to the device before Apple is required to charge for them. This is why many updates have been free; they have largely been about bug fixes and minor enhancements.

    The reason it applies to Apple's portables and not their computers, or to other game systems or such, at least as I understand it, has to do with their classifications as an "X" device. The iPod Touch is classified as a music player or personal media player, and therefore significant enhancements above and beyond its function as such add value to the device and therefore Apple must assign and charge a certain value for those enhancements in order to comply with SOX's regulations regarding fiscal transparency. In short, the new features make the device worth more, so Apple has to charge more so they can account financially for the added value to in order to be SOX-compliant.

    The iPhone (and AppleTV for that matter) are exempt because the revenue stream for these devices come from carrier subscriptions which are already accounted for on the balance sheet.

    Computers are exempt because they are general computing devices which are designed to be enhanced through software and OS upgrades. (There's a great deal of argument as to why the iPhone and iPod Touch can't be classified as computers -- because when you get right down to it, they are -- and why other devices like Windows Mobile and Palm devices don't charge for firmware upgrades. This is kind of gray area here to be honest and I'm not completely convinced that Apple couldn't reclassify their devices, but I assume there's some stickiness involved with reclassification, especially where SOX is concerned.)

    Not sure how game systems are exempt, but I assume that because their upgrades do not contain material enhancements that add significant functionality beyond their stated purpose then that's probably what keeps them from having to bother with SOX compliancy.

    Unfortunately, yes. SOX was a hastily slapped-together band-aid for what were viewed as some significant oversights in corporate regulation, and it's pretty poorly written at that, but it's what we're stuck with until they get around to thinking of something better.
     
  13. Geschlagen

    Geschlagen Active Member

    Mar 14, 2009
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    I have a 1g Touch and I soon want to buy a 2G, so I am especially interested in bluetooth xD
     
  14. spiffyone

    spiffyone Well-Known Member

    Dec 7, 2008
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    Exactly.

    Again, though, it's not the implementation of bluetooth. A dev can implement it in their app for devices that have it and still let it be run on 1st gen devices so long as the app itself isn't dependent on bluetooth. If, however, it is dependent on bluetooth, well then, yes, they've just screwed themselves out of the 15 million potential consumers who own 1st gen touch devices in addition to the 30 million potential consumers who own 2nd gen touch devices in your hypothetical.

    Drawing from a pool of ALL of the devices across the platform is drawing from a larger potential consumer base than if one locks out one (or more) of the devices from the platform. Do the latter, and you lose however many millions to which to sell product. Bad business decision.
     
  15. Palfince

    Palfince Well-Known Member

    Dec 30, 2008
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    I recently got a 2nd Gen Touch after my 1st Gen broke so I'm all for games that will use the 2nd Gen features. :rolleyes:

    2nd Gen runs much smoother as well. I just hope that they don't bring a 3rd Gen Touch out any time soon.
     
  16. THEDeliriumTrigger

    THEDeliriumTrigger Well-Known Member

    Dec 4, 2008
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    This pay-to-play system apple has is a failure. It will generate zero sales, and devs will be going back to the old system of free updates just to be competitive. I only see this happening to big brand games, the sims, but it wont be as you said- a dollar per gernade. Yeah, some might try it, but it wont stand. Now, as you read the sims actually had a valid reason to charge that dollar- in game music. Sure, it should be included, but the consumers will defeat the system, and things will fall back to normal.
     
  17. spiffyone

    spiffyone Well-Known Member

    Dec 7, 2008
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    Apple TV has a carrier subscription?

    Really?

    Because from my understanding of the product...it's basically a big ol' iPod...but not portable and without it's own screen...and obvious hardware differences vis a vis CPU,GPU,RAM, etc. But I didn't know there's a subscription service for it....
     
  18. Mew2468

    Mew2468 Well-Known Member

    Oct 20, 2008
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    I don't know if this has already been talked about, but...
    If you have 9 pages of apps, will spotlight go onto a 10th page? From what I've heard, you swipe left on the 1st page...
     
  19. markx2

    markx2 Well-Known Member

    Dec 28, 2008
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    The reason Apple will charge is not that Act. That does not apply outside of the USA and you can be sure Apple account differently per country. The reason is super simple.

    Because they can.
     
  20. The Game Reaper

    The Game Reaper Well-Known Member

    Dec 6, 2008
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    The Emerald Isle
    I'm really disappointed that Apple didn't bring Tapulous on stage demonstrating TTR2 with the new API that allows games to use your music library so you can play your own songs.
     

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