I like the game well enough. I wish there are more of such games in the appstore. I'm not so fond of the color scheme of the pieces though. Would be possible to let us decide the colors of the pieces in the options?
I was planning to use ScoreLoop or OpenFeint for online challenges (but don't get too excited, I hardly find the time to advance with this lately). As for other projects, I have some proofs of concept but nothing remotely finished. Whenever I find some time, I wonder between continuing Hanto or starting something completely different. This is one of the reasons for this post.
I like board games on the iPhone but look at the Top 100.. they don't sell unless it is a Hasbro/EA game.
I always been a booster of Hanto and quite enjoyed the app. I think it's always been a good one and its a pretty polished app. Two things. First I think Hanto/Hive is mostly unknown outside of a very niche community. It's hard for something like this to break out on its own. Secondly I think a game like this (and most boardgame adaptions to the iphone) need some sort of multiplayer online capability whether its real time or asynchronous. Online play can often act as a promotion tool as people are generally more interested to pimp a game if its likely they can play with friends instead of just the CPU. Chess, and Monopoly are some of the few games that can get away with it because of how well know they are but nearly every other boardgame for the American public needs everyway possible for it to be promoted including online play so a community can hopefully build.
Rula - I would add one more to your initial post - 8. No one knows how to play? I have never seen the app - but like games - especially ones that make you think - but I look at the game and am confused. It might be good to have a simple in game tutorial that guides one through a very simple game (if there is such a thing?). Also, I think that a lot of the games that are on IDevice tend to be short - pick up and play - sorts of games. Things like chess and the like - might be popular - but people generally talk about spending short periods of time on games - so if it is a game that you have to think a lot about, that will limit appeal - as your next move may be many hours away, and people will forget the strategy they were using. I like the art style - I agree that softening the colors would be nice, and more in keeping an asian theme. The graphics are the hexagons are very nice. Best of luck.
If you're gonna watch only one of those vids, watch the bottom one. Dice Towers rules for their frequent vid reviews on YouTube. I never liked the first one. POINT 2: on Boardgamegeek, the hypocrites there complain about Hanto ripping off Jon Yanni's work, YET there are tons of praise for all the photos of users own versions ppl make from art Clay, Nuts and fake gemstones, and other hex tiles. It's really that simple. A 6 year old could pick it up quick, and the BEST PART, is that it is pure strategy like Chess. No random dice or chance! To Rula: As with other Devs like those who were just interviewed for Spider, I like learning the backgrounds. What do you do? Have you made games before? How long did it take you to make Hanto, and did you do it your self? Has it "paid you back" in sales vs your time to make it at least? Finally, I think, if you have a day job, that seeing something else from you would be AWESOME! I've been dying for a Steve Jackson game (sjgames.com) but all they put out was a Fnord app. Where's Munchkin, or Cheez or Knightmare Chess??
Ethics The ethical problem is substantive. The game is someone else's idea. There are no other considerations imho. As a former developer, I am extremely unhappy that you can just take Mr. Yianni's creation, morph it a bit and claim you are doing us all a favor. Sucks afaic.
You're statement does not reflect reality or pragmatism. I live in Pittsburgh, where the Hamburger was invented. If you want a hamburger, what are your choices while driving around town? There's Wendy's, Burger King, McDonald's, Arby's, Sonic. All the same. Ethically challenged? No. The Ferris Wheel was made here as well. And the Banana Split. And Heinz Ketchup. Same argument. Should Ford complain that Honda took his idea and is putting a metal body on four wheels? What games do you play? Tetris, or Mino? Zombieville, or did Chillingo do wrong with Inkvaders??? Doom, or Modern Combat? Maybe you should give the dev of iFPS app grief. iFLight, or Harbor Master? Before iFlight, no such game, or even the genre, existed. I love Milton Bradley's RISK, but I bought LUX app, and I played it on my Macbook before that. In fact, a search on iTunes shows Strategery, World War, and even Conflict, which states its a "RISK style game". Do you know how many Stratego clones there are on the app store? It's the same thing thing. You can't patent game rules. The law is clear. No law was broken. Ethics isn't the right word you're looking for. Perhaps you mean scruples, because ethically you could argue that Yainni stole this and made a confabulation from Go, Checkers and Chess! Boy, that get's my goat, because I would LOVE to go after people who stole my ideas in the past, but I have no standing either. So, have at it!
While I agree on DarkNRG's vision of ideas, progress and choice, I appreciate amn624's opinion and thank him for expressing it here. If I just wanted to hear my own opinion on these matters I wouldn't have asked. About changing a little or much Yianni's idea, I dare say that the new movements and properties (flying, swapping, kamikaze, hatching, etc) are something new, interesting and worth a look, and Hanto is also a nice playground to develop new properties and discovering new variants (for everyone). The chance to customize and try right away with an AI is very interesting IMHO. I think some people are not angry because the application exists, but because I am charging for it. If Hanto were free, every Hive fan in the planet would fill me with praises and sympathies. But in the fan's mind, there is this poor struggling guy that invented this boardgame they love (like Rowling and Harry Potter), and this other bad mischievous guy that just snatched the idea and made millions of dollars out of it. Disgusting! Well, I will answer some of the questions posted here before: it was not free to develop Hanto, and no, I didn't get any money from it yet. Not even the $100 I paid Apple to be a developer(*). Not to mention the Mac I bought to develop or the iPhone. I even take my hours out of the equation (which in the market, makes an order of magnitude higher amount than the other two). I did it because I wanted to do it, of course, but from a monetary perspective this project has been a tremendous disaster. So, why not making it free and stop all the fuzz? Because I don't think that it is fair. I have a full time job in the software industry (but in other technologies). I spent 5 months of nights and weekends to graphically design, code, tune, test and release the first version of Hanto. A few days after it appeared, John complained and I decided to pull it off. It took me around another month to change the rules, invent the new ones and make them customizable. It took me less (about two weeks) to optimize the AI so it would be fast and challenging in any rule set. So I believe I am entitled to get some money from my work, or at least to get even with the costs. I think the application is a good piece of work, I believe in it, and there is an audience somewhere out there that will enjoy it. That said, I wrote before that only people like DarkNRG and their enthusiasm has kept me on this project, and I still believe that there is a lot of people that would also enjoy the App, so I keep asking in order to find a way to reach them. I have got very good answers so far, so please, keep them coming! Thanks to all. --------- (*) Before you wonder about the maths, I have sold more than 200 or 300 licenses of Hanto, but Apple keeps 30% and also they give you money when you accumulate $250 in any given currency, this has not happened yet for me (and I don't see it happening in the foreseeable future either).
WOW, that's some story, probably more the rule than the exception tho, with how the app store works. Either you hit the jackpot, or you don't break even bc of lack of exposure. I'd send a press release to some of the app websites, even ARN on TA or Hodapp, and other review sites. Just the nature of the story with Yainni is newsworthy and and interesting example of what happens daily, like in the forum today Warp Defense has a buzz about being a clone of Geo Defense. Following your passion is paramount, so I'm glad it was something I enjoy I wouldn't give up, as motivational speakers would say, it could be your 2nd/3rd game that hits paydirt! Chalk this up to experience, and maybe collaborate with another indie like the dude on the first page in this thread offered! You have the talent obviously, man I wish I could do what you can do, I'd be flooding the app store every month with something simple like Zombies and Me (EA's 8lb Gorilla) You're in Argentina or something, I think I saw on another site? Again, thanks for sharing, I appriciate your work even more. I believe you may be the ONLY PERSON that even ever gave another game maker the time of day and even pulled and modified your game, everyone else would say, "Screw you" LOL Hey, imitation is the most sincerest form of flattery
I bought a copy of Hanto today, it is an extremely polished game. I've only played it for a few minutes, and so I don't quite understand why I am allowed to place my pieces on some hexes that are highlighted, and not others. The music is great. Would it ever be feasible to release the soundtrack as a free mp3 download for purchasers of the game, as Chillingo does for anyone who buys Zen Bound? Another great feature would be a similar system of playing with friends as has been implemented in "chess with friends." Push notification of a move would be even better.
Hey Jase23! Welcome to TA! Check out the bottom video that DaveMc99 put up on page 3 of this thread. It will simply expain whats being well done in Hanto: showing the "legal" moves for the pieces that you're trying to move, given the rules for that piece, whether the basic rules or the custom rules you might of assigned it. For example, the Horse moves in Hanto like the Spider in the table game HIVE: "Must move 3 spaces". Also, it can not climb on top of another piece like the Beatle in HIVE (Crab in Hanto), or squeeze into a non-free flowing hex space, in other words, it must be able to move in and out of an empty space without "jumping". So, when you see the the highlights, those are legal moves for that piece you're touching. Any other space you can't move to, hence the strategy. Also, you can only be touching your piece/color, and can not touch your opponents piece/color, the FIRST TIME the piece is being played. This alone might throw you off until understanding the spawning of the piece. After the first move for any played tile, it can touch anything, givin it's a legal move or jump for that piece. In that sense, Hanto is the ultimate HIVE trainer/tutor BTW I love the Chess with friends for Hanto idea!!! A LOT!
Soundtrack You can download it for free directly from Kevin's site: http://www.incompetech.com/ You will have to find them individually, though. The Hanto Soundtrack consists of these songs: - FrostWaltz - AngloZulu - Arcadia - FeralChase - Machinations - Shamanistic - Supernatural - TempleOfTheManes - Faceoff - MysterySting Kevin has a lot of other great songs too. He is a very talented composer.
Just noticed the music. Is that public domain. I might not like the Japanese theme, but I do love the music as well as the game!! Thanks for the link and song info
Thank you very much for the link to the songs. by the way, I got a friend to purchase Hanto yesterday as well, and she was also impressed by the overall design and the music.
Thanks for the tips on the rules, and pointing me to the video. I've managed to play a few times and beat the computer on easiest setting. I understand more of the rules, now I just have to learn when I cannot move certain pieces that are already on the board. I think when playing video games on the iphone, I get into an expectation that all of the rules and gameplay should be instantly absorbed and understood. But I am a club level chess player, and if i were new to chess, I certainly could not pick up an iphone chess game and learn the rules of chess and start playing at a decent level within 2 minutes. A "chess with friends" style implementation, the ability to send moves back and forth to your friends and to people in your iphone contact list, and even push notification of a new move by your partner, would be ideal for Hanto.
Nevertheless a Hive clone Although this surely is of absolutely no importance for most iPhone gamers, quite a number of boardgame enthusiasts like me disliked the idea of buying a Hive ripoff. I've met John Yianni personally (a decent guy, by the way), and, while he designed other games as well, Hive may be THE one truly ingenious design of his lifetime. So I can very well understand, why he is annoyed. Idea theft is a very delicate issue in the boardgame world, as there is unfortunately no legal protection against that. Boardgame inventors work really hard to realize unique ideas, create something new, to get 'it' exactly right and rarely making a living with it. Who cares about the umpteenth Match-3 clone? So don't compare apples with oranges. Other than that -while I happily would have bought an 'official' Hive adaption- a game with similar mechanisms and slightly different rule sets, new piece sets to learn, which are quite confusing with the other game in mind (why not choose something completely different- aliens? knights? take what you want but not ANIMALS again) is, at least for me, owner of 300+ boardgames, not as attractive as you would think ;-) So you missed here if not the main- but an important part of your target audience. I bought your app to give it a try, and I appreciate the efforts to implement new ideas, but there is no lasting appeal for me, sorry. It's just too (confusingly) similar to that game I've played many many times with my friends. And, looking at your additions from a boardgame designer's view, more is sometimes less. With the existing simple rules Hive is already a very deep game. There are many elaborate chess clones out there, look how little successful they are: nobody needs another dozen movement options. Games like YINSH or DVONN (to quote Mr.Bass) have the charm of simplicity and instant learnability. HIVE has it, too. HANTO, unfortunately, has missed the mark here, albeit for understandable necessities. Why you didn't contact John before releasing Hanto remains a mystery to me- there are many "official" boardgame adaptions in the App store, not only trivial ones, take Reiner Knizia for example. I hope you are more lucky with your next app... Excuse my awkward writing, this is not my native language!
